A dream of playing full-time poker

    • TheBu11d0g
      TheBu11d0g
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.07.2008 Posts: 2,019
      I just love playing poker, especially now that i have a strategy to follow in the SSS, and i do have a dream of maybe one day playing poker full time.

      My hyperthetical question is this.....What levels would you need to play at to make a decent living from playing poker and is there a strategy that would be complimentary to playing poker full time.

      I ask this question so that i can have something to work towards and so that i can put a plan of action together via what to study, articles to read, videos to watch etc. that would help me see if my dream has any chance of becoming a reality a few years down the line :D
  • 20 replies
    • Kraelog
      Kraelog
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      Joined: 29.06.2008 Posts: 546
      Well first you need a bankroll of 50.000 at the very least. If you play poker for a living you need a lot of money in the bank as a buffer against downswings, sudden occurences in real life (get sick for 2 months for example) insurance etc...

      For the level, i'm not sure but i think NL400+
    • delete461
      delete461
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.07.2008 Posts: 1,036
      My youngest kid is 8 years old - my dream is to spend 10 years studying the game and improving then quit my job and go pro when the kids leave home. Would be nice to make decent money between now and then too though
    • TheBu11d0g
      TheBu11d0g
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      Joined: 25.07.2008 Posts: 2,019
      Ok Kraelog. Thank you for the info. At least i've got a start on what i need to do now.

      I'd better start saving up for that 50,000 roll then :D
    • DrFunk
      DrFunk
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      Joined: 07.01.2008 Posts: 348
      Originally posted by TheBu11d0g
      I'd better start saving up for that 50,000 roll then :D
      Wrong. Start EARNING that 50.000$ roll. ;)
    • TheBu11d0g
      TheBu11d0g
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      Joined: 25.07.2008 Posts: 2,019
      Lol. Im sorry, I'll start earning that roll right now sir :D
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
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      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      Hello TheBu11d0g,

      I disagree with posts in this thread. Imo, poker is THE game/sport where it's fairly easy to go pro in. You don't need a 50k roll, and you don't need nl400+ imo.

      What is needed is:

      1. discipline, you'll need to be your own boss, and get your ass behind the screen often enough
      2. ambition, settling for less then the top limits is not a good idea imo. A pro player is someone who wants to reach the top imo. Being mid stakes pro isn't that great, aside from the fact that the next step is high stakes
      3. make money. If you make enough money per month to live off, then you can become a pro. I became pro on 16$ sng's, for a measly 2K$ per month, but because I went pro that early, it was easier for me to focus on poker and just poker.
    • TheBu11d0g
      TheBu11d0g
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      Joined: 25.07.2008 Posts: 2,019
      Originally posted by helemaalnicks
      Hello TheBu11d0g,

      I disagree with posts in this thread. Imo, poker is THE game/sport where it's fairly easy to go pro in. You don't need a 50k roll, and you don't need nl400+ imo.

      What is needed is:

      1. discipline, you'll need to be your own boss, and get your ass behind the screen often enough
      2. ambition, settling for less then the top limits is not a good idea imo. A pro player is someone who wants to reach the top imo. Being mid stakes pro isn't that great, aside from the fact that the next step is high stakes
      3. make money. If you make enough money per month to live off, then you can become a pro. I became pro on 16$ sng's, for a measly 2K$ per month, but because I went pro that early, it was easier for me to focus on poker and just poker.
      Thanks for your very insightful reply Helemaalnicks. Like you say im not looking to reach super stardom from going pro but earning a nice living from it would be ideal and what im looking for. I'm self-employed at the moment so believe i have the necessary discipline to carry that part out and i've definately got the ambition as i wouldn't have started my own business if i didn't want to be at the top of the tree so i've got the 1st 2 shut down i think :D
      As for number 3 - what sort of roll do you think would be adequate or is it a case of having enough behind you to cover say 3/4 months of living expenses.
    • finchybg
      finchybg
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      Joined: 16.12.2007 Posts: 910
      It really depends where you live :P
      In Bulgaria an average of 1000$ a month is decent money, especially in the province.
      NL100 with bonuses can give you that but playing NL200 profitable(+ bonus, rakeback or whatever) may enable you to have a well-off lifestyle. Of course this is country dependant :)
      It's not for me though, I'd settle for poker as a nice side-income. But for a student(I begin in 1 week :D :D :D ) it's just what I need.
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
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      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      what sort of roll do you think would be adequate or is it a case of having enough behind you to cover say 3/4 months of living expenses.


      you need the roll to play the limits

      You need the limits to make a living, and more then that, otherwise your roll will stagnate.

      So let's say you need 1000$ a month for living expenses. Then, if you play 16$ sng's, you have to make 2000$ a month on avg, and you need 100BI roll, 1600$, plus imo 1 month of living expenses.

      Of course that's still a bit risky, but the more you move up, the less risky it gets, because you have the option to move down then.

      Life is risky anyway. I wouldn't save up 3-4 months of living expenses. If you go broke, then at least you tried, and you had a 150BI downswing, well, that might be a decent reason to quit poker and the dreams altogether.

      So those would be my adviced guidelines.
    • TheBu11d0g
      TheBu11d0g
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      Joined: 25.07.2008 Posts: 2,019
      Thank you helemaalnicks. All your advice has been greatfully appreciated and taken note off.
    • timukasr
      timukasr
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      Joined: 26.05.2007 Posts: 1,820
      One Estonian player proved that you can live successfully on NL50 FR (he played 100k hands in a month and earned some $9000). Of course he multi tabled quite much.
    • Sonydahaka
      Sonydahaka
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      Joined: 22.06.2008 Posts: 392
      How many years of poker took you to became a pro helemaalnicks?
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
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      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      Originally posted by Sonydahaka
      How many years of poker took you to became a pro helemaalnicks?
      4 months.
    • Kruppe
      Kruppe
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      Joined: 20.02.2008 Posts: 2,144
      hmm, what I originally wrote here was kind of missing the point.
    • Kraelog
      Kraelog
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      Joined: 29.06.2008 Posts: 546
      @helemaalnicks

      Well i'm sorry but i completely disagree with your position. Simply saying you can poker for a living without money in the bank for at least half a year isn't right. As long as you only need 1000$ living expenses and you make for example 2000$ a month everything might work, but that's not a basis to rely on for your entire life. There are a lot of things which can happen, good and bad, which could require a lot of money and/or keep you for playing poker.

      For example if you have a car accident and your hospitalized for 6 months with another 6 months for revalidation. How on earth will you be paying the medical bills? Social services covers alot but certainly not everything. How will you pay your rent? Your taxes?

      But good things also cost alot money. Now this might be a far away future for most on this board (i don't have clue but i assume most people here are 18-25), but you could meet someone and decide to start a family. I can assure you the living expenses will be alot more than 1k$. And you can't really provide any financial stability for your children, who do need that.

      One more: Pension?
      Most people build up a pension through constant monthly taxes. As a poker player you won't get any pension. How will you provide for yourself when your 60+? Not everyone can be a Doyle Brunson.


      If you're still young, only need to provide for yourself and have no intention in the foreseeable future to build a family, buy a home or save up for your old age and you know that you won't ever get into an accident or get seriously ill, then you don't any buffer and you can go right ahead living as a poker pro.

      But living your life as a poker pro means more than paying this month's bills.
    • NiekamNeidomu
      NiekamNeidomu
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.05.2007 Posts: 307
      Originally posted by Kraelog



      For example if you have a car accident and your hospitalized for 6 months with another 6 months for revalidation. How on earth will you be paying the medical bills? Social services covers alot but certainly not everything. How will you pay your rent? Your taxes?

      hmmm about 3rd and 2nd millennia BC Chinese and Babilon trades developet some good stuff.. that "STUFF" not only helped them in "hard situations" but also controled and helped the evolution of man kind.. oh yeah.. that stuff is called insurance policy ~_~
      if you dont think that rl is overrated ( some1 postet that idea in forum once xD ) so you can get one to !
    • Kraelog
      Kraelog
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      Joined: 29.06.2008 Posts: 546
      plz get me a free 100% covered insurance policy aswell....
    • Sonydahaka
      Sonydahaka
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      Joined: 22.06.2008 Posts: 392
      that means you are one of the genius players.....i think that poker has also something to do with your IQ....
      but stiil i asume that you played poker before you came to PS?
      How many books about poker had you read?
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      Simply saying you can poker for a living without money in the bank for at least half a year isn't right.


      and yet i still pulled it off!

      As long as you only need 1000$ living expenses and you make for example 2000$ a month everything might work, but that's not a basis to rely on for your entire life.


      who the hell wants to be pro poker player for his entire life?? LOL, thats sick dude. Sorry, but there is definitely more to life then poker, and despite the fact that ill probably never completely "cure from poker virus" I won't play it full time for my entire life. I have different (bigger) plans.

      For example if you have a car accident and your hospitalized for 6 months with another 6 months for revalidation. How on earth will you be paying the medical bills? Social services covers alot but certainly not everything. How will you pay your rent? Your taxes?


      yup, I told you i liked risks. Anyway, Im young, I wanna take risks. If things go wrong, I have lots of friends/family to support on. If things go right, I have even more friends and family who are of course noticing some benefits as well then.

      But good things also cost alot money. Now this might be a far away future for most on this board (i don't have clue but i assume most people here are 18-25), but you could meet someone and decide to start a family. I can assure you the living expenses will be alot more than 1k$. And you can't really provide any financial stability for your children, who do need that.


      If you go pro, and you're earning 1k a month, and 6 months later, you're still earning 1k a month, then you're obviously doing something wrong. You really think i still make 1k a month? No way, I was on the verge of quitting about 4-5 months ago, because I didn't see enough financial progression, but the question was "how much do you need to earn to become pro poker player?", and my answer was, for me, it's 1k a month, because im living rather cheaply atm.

      However, the "salary" for a pokerplayer has a lot of progression, and potential. I always said, and I still do say, that I won't settle for less then at least 10k$ a month as a salary on this job. It's much more stressfull then you'd think it is, and it's not that far from playing professional football imo. With a job like this, I think you need a salary that corresponds with the amount of stress, time and studying it takes to get to the high stakes.

      Im not saying earning 1k$ a month is a good amount for a pro poker player. Im saying it's a decent amount to start off with. If you can make 1k after not too long, then it should also be possible to make 10k$ a month 1 year later. Otherwise you should maybe consider quitting due to lack of talent/motivation.

      I strongly recommend anyone NOT to play pro poker their entire life, because there is more out there, and it's also not the easiest way of making quick money.

      But I also recommend people who want to be pro to start asap. This is simply because Ruud van Nistelrooy didn't waste his time in a kitchen cleaning dishes 40 hours a week when he was 17, because he had a big dream, and had to focus on it, and train for it as much as possible. If he'd decided to start studying law @ age 18, Im pretty sure he'd never play @ Real Madrid right now.

      50k$ is a ridiculous amount of money, and I would be able to live years on such a big amount. So that amount doesn't make any sense to me. Atm, my roll is big enough for at least a year of my living expenses, so that's my cover. I don't need a bankaccount with that amount of money for that. My roll is my cover.

      I will also advice everyone with this idea to be careful, and think about it before making the step, and also talk to your parents/friends about it. It's a big step, and it's not as easy as you might think it is. It takes a lot of sacrifices, and you have to be willing to make them. One clear example is that you can't drink whenever you like. I don't drink, except on rare occasions, because I need to stay fit, especially mentally.

      But in the end, it might be very good. I have to admit that I am extremely happy with my life and my plans right now, and there is no better feeling then making your own money, with making decisions about your own money. I have my own faith in my hands, and that's the best feeling I've ever had. But that's where my metaphor with pro football comes back into play. You're either born for it, or you aren't. It definitely sounds more "rough" then it really is, and you should think about whether life without colleagues, sitting at home most of the time playing/studying poker is really what you want.
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