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[NL2-NL10] NL10 SH Speed AK

    • Alleen86
      Alleen86
      Silver
      Joined: 27.05.2010 Posts: 5,320
      Hello!

      IPoker, $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      BB: $10 (100 bb)
      UTG: $30.48 (304.8 bb)
      MP: $16.73 (167.3 bb)
      CO: $10.40 (104 bb)
      Hero (BTN): $10 (100 bb)
      SB: $7.44 (74.4 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is BTN with K A
      UTG folds, MP raises to $0.30, CO raises to $0.90, Hero calls $0.90, SB calls $0.85, BB folds, MP calls $0.60

      Flop: ($3.70) 7 2 4 (4 players)
      SB checks, MP bets $2, 3 folds

      Preflop: Both MP and CO are regulars. MP might raise with any pocket pair and broadway, sometimes with suited connector. CO could 3b light there. If I 4bet, I doubt any of them would continue with worse. So I decided to call and keep their weaker ranges in the hand. If MP had 4bet, I would fold.

      Flop: The hand becomes multiway and I hit nothing, so decided to give up.

      MP: 22/18/65/2,5/4,9k (VPIP/PFR/Ft3B/AF/H)
      CO: 23/20/7,6/7,3/330 (VPIP/PFR/3B/AF/H)
  • 7 replies
    • BogdanPS
      BogdanPS
      Basic
      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 27,588
      Hi Alleen86,

      Preflop: Do you really want to play AKo multiway? Your hand rarely hits and doesn't play well multiway. Given the money in the pot a 4-bet is much better.
    • MarliesB
      MarliesB
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.04.2013 Posts: 685
      Hi Bogdan,

      I'm having a bit of trouble understanding how we can play profitably if we get called or shoved.
      If we cold 4bet, they probably put us on QQ+, right? So they'll call or shove with that too.
      If we do hit the king, the only thing we beat is QQ but we probably won't get value from it (or do we?)
      fi we hit the ace, we beat QQ and KK but we probably won't get value from the (or do we?)
      Also, if we get shoved, won't we be facing AA/KK most of the time?

      Just a bit of a mess up in my mind,
      thanks.
    • Alleen86
      Alleen86
      Silver
      Joined: 27.05.2010 Posts: 5,320
      Originally posted by BogdanPS
      Hi Alleen86,

      Preflop: Do you really want to play AKo multiway? Your hand rarely hits and doesn't play well multiway. Given the money in the pot a 4-bet is much better.
      Would that be a bluff 4bet? Should I call if someone shoves? I was scared of someone shoving because I have a feeling that it would be only with QQ+, maybe even just KK+. That's why I just called.

      Thanks! :)
    • BogdanPS
      BogdanPS
      Basic
      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 27,588
      Yes, in most cases we can still fold after a shove in spots like this (assuming you don't 4-bet huge).

      I don't expect a ton of calls to a 4-bet here when you cold 4-bet in these positions and I think the one thing, that both of you, Marlie and Alleen, are forgetting is that the most profitable part is when both fold and we collect the dead money.

      This will happen often when you have such an active 3-better.
    • MarliesB
      MarliesB
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.04.2013 Posts: 685
      Hi BogdanPS,

      sorry for going on about it but how about this:
      if we are cold 4betting mainly to pick up dead money and not really for postflop +EV, wouldn't it be better to 4bet the slightly weaker hands like AQ/AJ and call AK?
    • fusionpk
      fusionpk
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.01.2010 Posts: 1,692
      Originally posted by MarliesB
      Hi BogdanPS,

      sorry for going on about it but how about this:
      if we are cold 4betting mainly to pick up dead money and not really for postflop +EV, wouldn't it be better to 4bet the slightly weaker hands like AQ/AJ and call AK?
      In this spot you wouldn't call with AQ or AJ anyway. Yes you could use them as bluff 4b'ing hands but they arn't as good as AK since you clearly think his stack off range is super tight. So the K makes a small difference.

      Personally, given the stats, I would 4b/call AK here. Probably not bother with a cold 4b bluffing range vs nl10 guys.

      I think 4b calling (slightly)> 4b folding > calling

      If you have reads that CO only stacks off to cold 4b's very tight then ofc 4b/folding becomes a better option.
    • BogdanPS
      BogdanPS
      Basic
      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 27,588
      Originally posted by MarliesB
      Hi BogdanPS,

      sorry for going on about it but how about this:
      if we are cold 4betting mainly to pick up dead money and not really for postflop +EV, wouldn't it be better to 4bet the slightly weaker hands like AQ/AJ and call AK?
      To add to what fusion said we would be close to 4-bet calling here but I don't think 4-bet folding is a big mistake.

      What you have to keep in mind is that if you call you will play multiway with a hand that rarely hits. Why would you want that?