Techically not cheating, but is this punishable?

    • boboistina
      boboistina
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.05.2008 Posts: 271
      So, i was playing some 5$ SnGs on FTP like i do almost every day then this happens

      ***** Hand History for Game 1111111111 ***** (Full Tilt)
      Tourney Hand NL Texas Hold'em - Tuesday, August 13, 02:26:28 ET 2013
      Table 5 Sit Go (257696450) Table 1 (Real Money)
      Seat 9 is the button
      Seat 1: Player1 ( 8955 )
      Seat 2: Player2 ( 200 )
      Seat 7: Player7 ( 3440 )
      Seat 9: Hero ( 905 )
      Player1 posts small blind [100].
      Player2 posts big blind [200].
      ** Dealing down cards **
      Dealt to Hero [ 5s 5h ]
      Player7 folds
      Hero folds
      Player1 folds
      Player2 wins 100
      Player2 wins 200 from main pot

      Player2 was sitting out for a while now. So after thinking it out a bit i decided not to shove thinking player1 will surely call and maybe knock out player2 so i'll get ITM. After he folds, i though "ok, maybe a missclick or something".

      Then few hands after same situation again

      ***** Hand History for Game 1111111111 ***** (Full Tilt)
      Tourney Hand NL Texas Hold'em - Tuesday, August 13, 02:27:03 ET 2013
      Table 5 Sit Go (257696450) Table 1 (Real Money)
      Seat 9 is the button
      Seat 1: Player1 ( 8955 )
      Seat 2: Player2 ( 200 )
      Seat 7: Player7 ( 3440 )
      Seat 9: Hero ( 905 )
      Player1 posts small blind [100].
      Player2 posts big blind [200].
      ** Dealing down cards **
      Dealt to Hero [ 5d Kd ]
      Player7 folds
      Hero folds
      Player1 folds
      Player2 wins 100
      Player2 wins 200 from main pot

      So techically he isnt cheating but is being a total scumbag and making unfair plays.
      I've reported it to FTP but am not hoping much it'll be punished.

      What do you guys think? Should this be punishable? Have you or would you ever do something like this? Personally i have never done something like this, and would never do it.
  • 17 replies
    • SheepMoose
      SheepMoose
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.01.2009 Posts: 854
      Oh... how dare somebody not put their chips in!

      Seriously, what rules does this break? You've just given FTP support and this person a lot of trouble for nothing.
    • gadget51
      gadget51
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2008 Posts: 5,622
      Hi boboistina,

      I've moved this to Beginners Questions for you. :)


      I've seen this often, the big stack is keeping the shorty in so he can punish all you others by stealing the blinds until you're so short he has a huge advantage when he gets three-handed.

      Let's face it who wants to bubble out of you others with a a sitout there?

      That's what it looks like at face value anyway, villain is just exploiting the situation, that isn't cheating that's clever play.

      Just my 2c worth and possibly not very accurate because I don't play many SnGs.

      Regards,

      Mal.
    • UPAY4DINNER
      UPAY4DINNER
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.09.2009 Posts: 21,926
      Originally posted by gadget51
      that isn't cheating that's clever play.


      +1
    • RasTweet
      RasTweet
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.12.2009 Posts: 4,553
      Hey there boboistina

      It's not fun when they like that :(

      But on the other hand I think you should've shoved 55 yourself. I don't play SnG's so I might be wrong but I think thats the correct play.

      Regards

      RasTweet
    • inoimbluffingdou
      inoimbluffingdou
      Basic
      Joined: 09.06.2013 Posts: 42
      Originally posted by gadget51
      Hi boboistina,

      I've moved this to Beginners Questions for you. :)


      I've seen this often, the big stack is keeping the shorty in so he can punish all you others by stealing the blinds until you're so short he has a huge advantage when he gets three-handed.

      Let's face it who wants to bubble out of you others with a a sitout there?

      That's what it looks like at face value anyway, villain is just exploiting the situation, that isn't cheating that's clever play.

      Just my 2c worth and possibly not very accurate because I don't play many SnGs.

      Regards,

      Mal.
      But doesn't go down well with those who are in it..
      Wow imagine they all did that changes the whole game
    • TinoLaan
      TinoLaan
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.10.2011 Posts: 6,411
      But doesn't go down well with those who are in it..
      Wow imagine they all did that changes the whole game
      Well of course it sucks when they do this to you. However, it's a perfectly valid, and arguably the best strategy for the player with the big stack. Yes it sucks when you get exploited like that, but unfortunately there's just nothing you can do in such a case!

      Just remember this for when you are the big stack in a situation like this and be the one to exploit the others yourself ;)
    • Walshnm
      Walshnm
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2008 Posts: 198
      Think this is standard online angle - Let's face it - A good poker player takes any edge he can get?

      GL GL GL
    • Lazza61
      Lazza61
      Headadmin
      Headadmin
      Joined: 23.03.2011 Posts: 9,219
      Originally posted by gadget51

      I've seen this often, the big stack is keeping the shorty in so he can punish all you others by stealing the blinds until you're so short he has a huge advantage when he gets three-handed.

      Let's face it who wants to bubble out of you others with a a sitout there?

      That's what it looks like at face value anyway, villain is just exploiting the situation, that isn't cheating that's clever play.

      Just my 2c worth and possibly not very accurate because I don't play many SnGs.

      Regards,

      Mal.


      Spot on, Mal.

      Incidentally, your 2c worth is now worth more, lol :tongue:
    • metza
      metza
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      Hold on, if you shove 55, and player 1 calls and player 2 is sat out and all in automatically w 1bb, even if you bust out you're ITM unless somehow player 2 wins the hand but I think their hand is mucked even if all in while sitting out (not 100% sure on this rule since I play cash games)
    • kierantierney
      kierantierney
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.08.2011 Posts: 57
      Yes gadget has it right. With a big chip lead you can bully the bubble. Players loosen up when they are ITM and will make Nash calls and shoves as they should. You cant make these plays with ashort stack in as it would be ICM suicide. That's poker!
    • MERIT900
      MERIT900
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.05.2012 Posts: 44
      on titan poker the sit out players final all in hand plays so you can bubble behind it
    • gadget51
      gadget51
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2008 Posts: 5,622
      So I am now worth 9c, thank you! :s_love:

      I did find a video about playing big stacks but unfortunately it was Gold Status. X(

      Mal.
    • VladimirN
      VladimirN
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.02.2008 Posts: 438
      I recently had a similar situation where a respectable reg kept folding on the bubble (6-max) to a guy who had around 500 chips, I had 1.500 and reg had 7.000. He folded around 4-5 times in a row to him and explained it as a "bubble play". I said to him: "Well, you just missed your opportunities to cash.".

      I don't see this very often, if at all, in my ~60k SnGs played so I had to open up and attack the small stack myself (over the big stack). Big stack called me with a dominated hand and lost. Then the small stack quadrupled up after 2 all ins, when the reg started tilting and called my QJ with J2 and busted.

      I suppose it's a correct strategy, but you stand the risk of not cashing yourself (and you look like a fucking douchebag).
    • WinStrat
      WinStrat
      Bronze
      Joined: 20.12.2011 Posts: 138
      A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

      I always aim to eliminate players as fast as possible.

      I hate when a player is allin and someone instead of a checkdown starts to bet hard with total air.
    • Lazza61
      Lazza61
      Headadmin
      Headadmin
      Joined: 23.03.2011 Posts: 9,219
      Originally posted by VladimirN
      I recently had a similar situation where a respectable reg kept folding on the bubble (6-max) to a guy who had around 500 chips, I had 1.500 and reg had 7.000. He folded around 4-5 times in a row to him and explained it as a "bubble play". I said to him: "Well, you just missed your opportunities to cash.".

      I don't see this very often, if at all, in my ~60k SnGs played so I had to open up and attack the small stack myself (over the big stack). Big stack called me with a dominated hand and lost. Then the small stack quadrupled up after 2 all ins, when the reg started tilting and called my QJ with J2 and busted.

      I suppose it's a correct strategy, but you stand the risk of not cashing yourself (and you look like a fucking douchebag).
      It's major effectiveness is in 9 man SnGs and it doesn't crossover as well to 6 man.

      The reason for this is bigstack can keep shorty in while he attacks the other two if they appear to be waiting for the shorty to bust. This has a significant effect on the prizepool equity.

      This tends to happen very often in situations where the bigstack has more than 50% of the chips in play.
    • Lazza61
      Lazza61
      Headadmin
      Headadmin
      Joined: 23.03.2011 Posts: 9,219
      Also for this to work at it's best, the shorty must be on the direct left of the bigstack.
    • metza
      metza
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      Originally posted by WinStrat
      I hate when a player is allin and someone instead of a checkdown starts to bet hard with total air.
      IMO this is one of the douchiest things in poker when there is no sidepot and they bet air, probably only slowrolling is worse.