Plo Sh Vpip & Pfr

    • ittapiros
      ittapiros
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.08.2008 Posts: 27
      Hello everyone!

      I'm getting acquainted with PLO SH. However I feel like I have a pretty severe leak in my game. This leak originates from NLH I think but I can't be sure, that is why I turn to the community.

      When you play holdem, usually it is best to approach it like a bet & fold game as far as I know, so the gap VPIP & PFR is small as possible. I've adopted this concept to my ohama game AFTER I have actually played from sort of gutt. Before I applied this, I had a little gap between the two (something like 27/17). After watching a few videos, on the basic principle on folding ALL trash hands or ones with "hangers", my stats look more like this: 18/16, and though I've noticed swings are way less severe, my winnings are way smaller as well so I feel like I have misunderstood something about this concept. It almost seems like calling more and/or limping in PLO SH is something one should apply to his game. Since I have been folding a lot of my hands I would normally not, I realize I miss a bunch of nice situatuions to make money. I basically think I am too tight.

      My question is what is a normal, (definetly not LAG) VPIP/PFR stat for a decent PLO player? (assume PLO10-PLO50)

      Also if I should limp, when is it a good idea to do so?

      I'm still learning the game on PLO10 before I move up, but I want to build up a decent edge on every limit, to make moving up easier.

      Thanks for the help!
      Peter
  • 6 replies
    • acerbikas
      acerbikas
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.01.2011 Posts: 229
      I'm not a good PLO player yet, but as a beginner who is trying to better his game I want to try and answer these questions based on the info I found out while studying here. I remember Skodjlivec said that 27/17/7 were stats of a decent player and it is certainly not easy to maintain profit with it if you still do not know what you are doing

      I think OOP the best thing you can do is call off, esp in multiway pots, cause 3betting into many opponents won't do you any good and just bloat the pot and make your hand vulnerable (as if it isn't already :P ).

      IP 3betting is vital, but you need to laern to do that, as there are issues with it and it isn't easy to win pots where you completely whiff.

      As for limping, I think you can limp weak kings and aces from late positions if you are sure noone is 3betting behind u. These hands can flop well and the aggressive players may pounce on the limping as a weakness, hence stacking off and losing money.
    • ittapiros
      ittapiros
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.08.2008 Posts: 27
      Very good answer thank you!
    • Skodljivec
      Skodljivec
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.12.2011 Posts: 5,709
      Hi,

      well something around 20-25VPIP and 16-20PFR is imo very good for micros, but even something like 18/16 and 27/17 are both fine as well.

      You can definetly limp sometimes, but never open limp. Also, they are called danglers, not hanglers :) .

      Regards,

      Skod
    • ittapiros
      ittapiros
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.08.2008 Posts: 27
      Thanks Skodljivec!

      I think I'll return to my original approach to tend to the relatively looser side, 20-25VPIP and 16-20PFR.

      Good thing you mention never to open limp.

      I'll play a couple K hands and I'll let you know what changed, maybe it will help others later as well.

      I knew when I wrote "hangers" there was something wrong, but I couldn't think of "danglers" lol.. : D
    • Kyyberi
      Kyyberi
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 09.07.2010 Posts: 10,511
      I like to say that postflop skills dictate preflop decisions. As an example: If you can't play profitably in marginal postflop situations, don't get into them by playing marginal preflop hands.

      The reason I am saying this is that you shouldn't aim to any specific preflop stats. It will always be highly dependable on your opponents (especially at micros where the range of opponents is super wide) and you own skills. And in PLO, your 15% PFR range might be totally different than someone else's.

      So learn the game and thinking process, and do good decisions one at the time.

      Of course if your preflop stats are VERY different you should what is the reason for that.
    • ittapiros
      ittapiros
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.08.2008 Posts: 27
      Yeah very true, good thing to consider. Thanks a lot!