1-2 Live Game : I need Advise

    • JimmyPap
      JimmyPap
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      Joined: 02.03.2008 Posts: 65
      I recently discovered that they play 1-2 NL holdem in a local card room (not poker room, they play all kind of card games with money there), so I went and played a couple of times.

      I'm not a cash game player online, I play SNGs mainly, just some .5/.10 cash for fun.

      this room is in Greece, where not a lot of people play holdem, though they play a lot a variation of poker called "poka". Its a dealers choice game where you play with a 32 card deck 7 and up only.

      I'm saying that because I experienced a crazy game.. where they would call with any 2, and raise with J,2 offsuit preflop. The games were 4 and 5 handed, and they were bluffing like mad most of the time.

      FYI I won 45 euro the first time and 130 the second.

      80% of the people in that room are sick gamblers from what I experienced, and the card sharks there would raise to 10-15 preflop most of the time with nthing just to scare you off the pot.

      These 2 games I was playing pretty solid poker.

      From the 9-10 players I sat in these games NONE really knows anything about odds and outs, and its damn hard to raise and not get called!

      The advice I need is whether I should continue playing there, Keep what bankroll and what style should I play to beat the game.
  • 10 replies
    • davidangel
      davidangel
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      Joined: 03.09.2008 Posts: 456
      Sounds like you got yerself a gold mine.
      Keep going, as long as there is lots of chum you will clean up. Play the TAG style, big stack if you can. If they wont fold, find a hand and make em pay.
      Maybe you could grind online SSS for awhile, its easy, low variance and you get to see alot of ring game hands, and see how they play.
    • Sebra
      Sebra
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      Joined: 01.08.2006 Posts: 1,121
      You should stay away, it's one big scam! If they can raise J2o in a 32-cards game 7 or higher.. didn't you get suspicious at that point?
    • JimmyPap
      JimmyPap
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.03.2008 Posts: 65
      err... zebra.. the J2off raise was in the holdem game not the other game :P

      I'm still playing this game almost daily... and I really would need solid advice.
      I'm now reading books on tells, and man.. did they help me today :P

      its a very very loose game.. There are people that play it and they would get on MAAAAD TILD.. all the time.. rebuying time after time.. and complaining why they cant win a pot when they enter with 9,5 etc..

      a game that starts with 50 euro buy-in will end in an hour with over 7-8 hundred to be claimed... often more than a K..

      I'm playing very tight all the time.. which gives me a lot more respect that I would need most of the times..

      Only a week playing so I want to learn how most of the players play first.
      I 'm trying to set em up and start taking opportunities when the circumstances and the table will be right to cash out big ... For the moment I conrol the wins and loses to small amounts.. like wining a 100 here.. losing 70 there.. No big swing.
    • Solomaextra
      Solomaextra
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      Joined: 17.07.2008 Posts: 7,401
      Call almost any two in unraised pot preflop but postflop play tight, raise only strong hands like AJ+ and you will win, I met these types of games before.
    • armo
      armo
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.03.2008 Posts: 451
      In maniacal games position will be even more important, I would try to sit where the most aggressive players are on your right. And definitely you don't want to be sitting between the two maniacs, you will get sandwiched with raises and reraises very often. Also I would not make raises with hands like AT,AJ,KQ,KJ and small-medium pp. If games preflop are loose and passive then I would try to play more suited or unsuited connectors, high gapped connectors.

      Also if you feel the regulars there are respecting your bets and raises, then use it to steal some pots.

      About that short deck game - does no that diminish the value of flush and increase the value of other hands?
    • JimmyPap
      JimmyPap
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      Joined: 02.03.2008 Posts: 65
      Yea, at the short deck games there are some where the 3 are better than the str8 and the flush of the full house and others where the opposite stands.

      There are games where you allways have a good hand but rarely its the best.. Theres more gambling involved, and players that lose mostly play short stakcs and push all in with any 2 and try to get lucky and get a piece of the pot.

      The above happens all the time in the game I play. Most of em when they lose buy up only a few chips and move all in preflop with any 2.. So, limping with conectors and such is hard.. cause theres a 90% chance a player behind will raise the pot to 10 euro. I pick to play solid hands big pocket pairs and big aces, suited aces, and if I can limp KQ QJ or KJ or see a relatively cheap flop I will do so.

      In position I would limp suited/unsuited conectors or make plays with them taking advantage of my very tight image.

      The people I play are a pick of like 12-15 people in a 5 or 6 handed game (which I prefer a lot more). So most of the times its the same people over and over, and studying them for 10 days along with reading books and articles on tells has tremendously helped me last 2 games.

      Its amazing how easy you can pick the tells, and the vast majority of them are the damn standard ones. Its just that these people never though about reading anything on them, or trying to play the game of reading cards and people.. they believe its a cards game only..

      I won an 80 euro pot just by seeing one them doing the xact same things a 3rd time the moment he raised preflop. I reraised him all in on the turn with 8,3o.. on a JJ9 flop where I called his bet. Turn was a 2. I also showed him the bluff thinking that it will either slow him down when I'm in a pot with him, or make him try more and more exposing the same tell :P

      I can tell ya one thing for sure. This game as it is motivated me to study holdem much more intensivly on all apsects of it. I'm watching the high stakes poker seasons from a different perspective now, trying to analyse the plays, I'm reading much more, especially on tells and basicly spend the time playing poker live instead of in front of a monitor :) And btw, 6 handed live with no dealer, and a timer set at 1 hour is FASTER than any cash game on the internet :P
    • JimmyPap
      JimmyPap
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.03.2008 Posts: 65
      Just an update..

      I established myself as a rock solid player in this local card room holdem game.
      Whenever I raise I get a lot of respect, and I'm rarely getting reraised.
      so that helps me a lot when I decide to bluff people out of a pot, 90% of the time they fold.

      So I'm up ~900 euro in my bankroll although I keep doing mistakes and fail into getting some more value bets in when I know people would call, or folding with the 2nd nuts when I know I'm beaten (If I had done half the mistakes I would have been up 3 and 4x of where I am now..)

      Trying to improve my game in all aspects, training myself into playing against the players I described in my first posts, because thats the majority of players I'll meet in the casino tables in a few months when Holdem will be legalized in Greece.

      I still need advise and I'm waiting for a live game forum in here where I could post hands for discussion.

      More articles in the live section would help a ton too!

      Till then I keep on studying the books (mainly Sklansky and Doyles super system) and writing down the mistakes in specific hands looking for what the best plays would be.
    • TribunCaesar
      TribunCaesar
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      Joined: 29.04.2007 Posts: 13,264
      Sounds like a gold mine. If you have such a tight image, I'd say start to loosen up a bit, like raise suited connectors and raise more from the BU and CO. When they start to donk around again, tighten up again. Try to get tells from the guys. They should be pretty unexperienced concerning body language.
    • davidangel
      davidangel
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.09.2008 Posts: 456
      If you have good ears you can hear truth or lie in thier voices. First you have to get them to say something you know to be true, and listen to the pitch. Then, get them to lie to you, you will hear a different pitch. This does NOT have to be related anyway to poker. Talk about the weather, sports, TnA, whatever, you are looking for a tell/read. Then, when you find them raising/calling you, ask them questions. It does not matter what you ask them, thier voice will tell you what they have. Thats the reason any pro will tell you that if you are in a hand with Daniel N. DO NOT TALK TO HIM!!
      Sounds like a goldmine, happy chum hunting.
    • JimmyPap
      JimmyPap
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.03.2008 Posts: 65
      The "bad" thing in the game is that it runs in sets of an hour. So when they loose their first , usually 50 euro, buyin, they start donking a lot.

      In a one hour session, they want fast play. They dont like it when you take 20 secs to think and reraise them, imagine their reactions if you start asking them bout the wheather.. lol

      Today was a bad day, last 5 mins I lost an all in push with JJ on a J,7,3 rainbow when 2 called, one with AA, and the second with a 4,Q of diamons with one diamond on the flop. The guy with the suited junk hand won :P

      I know you want them to allways call you in these situations, but it hurts to lose a big stack with only 5 mins left to play..