[NL25 Zoom] Step by step... I will not surrender!

    • rootakashi
      rootakashi
      Silver
      Joined: 01.03.2011 Posts: 2,494
      Hi! First of all excuse my poor English - it's not my native language. My name is Vlad. Now I'm playing NL25SH Zoom. Here is my graph since the middle of October:
      You can see that the quality of my game has dropped significantly at the end - I have had to make the platinum status to participate in this course. :rolleyes: To date I successfully completed several courses for the beginners from pokerstrategy conducted in Russian community: BSS (twice :D ), MSS and SNG. And now just finishing the second MSS course. I like these courses, they motivate me.

      And my main goal in this course is also motivation. I also think I've already grown out of courses for the beginners. May be this course for advanced players will help me to learn something new and to improve my game. In any case I hope and believe it will.

      A month ago I was planning to beat NL100 till the end of the year. But the end of last month has diminished my confidence. I decided not to hurry and first of all to work over quality of my game. So I am here.
  • 13 replies
    • pleno1
      pleno1
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 19.11.2010 Posts: 5,596
      Hey

      So which style do you prefer to play? SSS? MSS? BSS? I think playing all the styles really help you a lot because it means you can play vs different stack sizes and feel comofrtable, for example many of the top nl500 guys may be fantastic at 100bb but struggle at 30bb.
    • ErikStenqvist
      ErikStenqvist
      Global
      Joined: 14.01.2013 Posts: 431
      Hey rootakashi!

      Welcome to the Bootcamp!

      I'll be on the coaching staff working on mindset, tilt, and a-game related issues. But also to set solid good goals for 2014.

      Is there anything you feel you should be working on when it comes to mindset and tilt for example?

      If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask. :)


      Cheers!
    • rootakashi
      rootakashi
      Silver
      Joined: 01.03.2011 Posts: 2,494
      Originally posted by pleno1
      Hey

      So which style do you prefer to play? SSS? MSS? BSS? I think playing all the styles really help you a lot because it means you can play vs different stack sizes and feel comofrtable, for example many of the top nl500 guys may be fantastic at 100bb but struggle at 30bb.
      Hi, Patrick! I prefer BSS, because it gives me more space to maneuver. But sometimes I switch to MSS style. For example when I move up to a higher limit or when the luck is not on my side, like now.

      I watched your video for the boot camp and I'm impressed that throughout all the session you do not use any popups. You use only HUD to make decision. I use a lot of monstrous popups and notecaddy definitions. And I can't imagine how to play without them. Patrick, would you be so kind to share your secret? Do you remember all the regs at the limit? Or can you really put your opponent on a range at every street, having just a few numbers from HUD?
    • rootakashi
      rootakashi
      Silver
      Joined: 01.03.2011 Posts: 2,494
      Also in the video from Uri Peleg the following thought sounded: when you are using the leaks of your opponents, do it in unobvious way. If someone has a high fold to 3bet or high fold to 3 barrels, and you begin to exploit it at every opportunity, then he'll notice it soon. And will play against you in a different way than with other players. And you'll be losing money until you notice it. But when you notice it, you'll have a very different dynamics that may not be profitable.

      Frankly, I often encounter this problem because I do not balance my exploiting range. What do I mean? If my opponent has a high fold to 3bet (>70%), I literally start 3bet him with any two. Even micro stakes regs are able to notice it and to adjust vs me. And I have absolutely no idea how to play against them then. Could anyone give me some advice on what to consider when extending the range, please? How widely it can be extended? What reference points I have to adhere to not go too far?
    • rootakashi
      rootakashi
      Silver
      Joined: 01.03.2011 Posts: 2,494
      Originally posted by ErikStenqvist
      I'll be on the coaching staff working on mindset, tilt, and a-game related issues. But also to set solid good goals for 2014.

      Is there anything you feel you should be working on when it comes to mindset and tilt for example?

      If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask. :)
      Hi, Erik!

      Yes, I have problems in this area. But I have to formulate them first. I will write about it later.
    • Schnitzelfisch
      Schnitzelfisch
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.11.2008 Posts: 4,952
      Hi rootakashi,

      I'll be helping you out in this Boot Camp with topics like procrastination, motivation, laziness, productivity, focus while playing, putting in more volume/studying, creating habits that stick, etc.

      You mentioned that a big issue of yours is motivation.

      Could you please tell me:

      1) A bit more details about this. Which are the things that you ARE motivated to do and which are those which you aren't?
      2) What did you try so far to resolve this issue?
      3) What worked and what didn't?

      Thank you,

      -Primoz
    • ErikStenqvist
      ErikStenqvist
      Global
      Joined: 14.01.2013 Posts: 431
      Hi, Erik!

      Yes, I have problems in this area. But I have to formulate them first. I will write about it later.
      Sounds good! When you are done just pm me here on the forums so I don't miss it :)

      Nice work!
    • rootakashi
      rootakashi
      Silver
      Joined: 01.03.2011 Posts: 2,494
      Originally posted by ErikStenqvist
      Hi, Erik!

      Yes, I have problems in this area. But I have to formulate them first. I will write about it later.
      Sounds good! When you are done just pm me here on the forums so I don't miss it :)

      Nice work!
      Sorry for delay. I spent a lot of time to formulate this. But it still looks chaotically. Well, I think I have to post it anyway, because time is going and the end of this course is close... If something is unclear, I can explain this during discussion.

      1. My first problem is that I can't play more than 4-6 usual tables (I mean classical tables, not zoom). The reason is that when the action begins at the same time at 3 or more tables, it's hard to me to concentrate on every hand and hold all this information in my head. I have to distract constantly to press the button on another table, otherwise I'll spend all timebank there and fall into 'sit out'. That is not good. I make many mistakes at such a moments... But when I play 4-6 tables, it becomes boring for me and I start playing very loose and make mistakes too... I mean that sometimes I need more time to make a decision. In these moments I fall to 'sit out' at other tables. But the most part of time I can make quick decisions and the game on a small amount of tables seems to me boring. May be that is the reason why I play zoom. Game speed there is more adaptive.

      2. I can't choose a convenient arrangement for usual tables. When they are tiled, it's difficult to me to place my huge HUD so that it blocked nothing (for example, villain's stack, his nickname and the size of his bet or location of the button). In this layout figures in the HUD become too small and my eyes become tired very quickly. Besides, it's hard to me to hold in sight more than 4-6 tables. And I often fall to 'sit out' just because didn't notice that I have to make a move. I found more convenient layout: 4 tables in a tile, under them 4 more tables in a tile. But there is another problem. If the action occurs at two tables, located one below another, I can mix them and make a mistake. For example, at one table I received 88, behind another 66. I raised both. At the table where I have 88 everybody folded. But I didn't notice it. And with 66 I received a call and flop is 8TA. I can play 66 as a set of the eights just because it's in the same area of the screen where I just had 88. : rolleyes:

      3. Probably for these 2 reasons I play zoom. But even in zoom it's difficult to me to play more than 2 tables. Because for making decisions I check a huge number of stats and notecaddy notes in popups. I try to consider everything: previous dynamics, timing tells, etc. I'm trying to get into villains mind, to feel, what he is planning to do. If I did this and lost, it's OK. But if I skipped some steps and made a mistake... I do not feel that its OK. It negatively affects my self-assessment.

      I'd like to learn to make decisions more quickly. Because I have to spend more time to play the same number of hands which others regs can play much quicker. I'd like to learn to play at usual tables. Because I can select more profitable tables there. And I noticed that weak players are inclined to play there more loose. For example, the same fish can play 50/13 at usual tables and 30/13 in a zoom. So what do you think, where the regs earn more? But I was repeatedly convinced in practice that when I play more than 6 tables, I can only lose. :rolleyes:

      And now for tilt... I have an old psychological problem. When I face with downstrike, I start doubting in profitability of my strategy. I begin to think that it does not work anymore... And now I'm just one more fish at the limit. At such a moments I need a confirmation that my decisions was correct. I do it for every decision, even for default lines. I lose ability to see the situation in the long term. I even start doubting in correctness of ranges which I give to opponents. I look for confirmation of the correctness of my decisions in the hand history, setting the similar line in HM2 filters for this opponent. I spend a lot of time doing this. And I am not confident in efficiency of such approach, because I do not move forward, but just convince myself that I am right.

      Also, if the strike proceeds, I narrow my preflop ranges to reduce dispersion. And I also increase sizing of my bets and raises. I do this to not allow my villain to caught his outs. If I make villain to fold his hand or to go all-in with it before showdown, then my red and EV lines will look pretty good on the graphics - it helps me to convince myself in the correctness of my decisions. :facepalm:

      Now some words about my goals. As I already said, one month ago I was planning to beat NL100 till the end of this year. But now I feel that it will take more time... may be till the May 2014. And I'm not sure that I do enough for this purpose. I periodically analyze played hands and twice a week I discuss them with another NL25 regs, I watch video and I visit free trainings from pokerstrategy. What else can I do to accelerate my progress? Thank you in advance for answer.
    • Tomaloc
      Tomaloc
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.01.2011 Posts: 6,858
      hey, i also play zoom25 2tables and our approaches and issues seem very similar. good luck :D
    • rootakashi
      rootakashi
      Silver
      Joined: 01.03.2011 Posts: 2,494
      Originally posted by Tomaloc
      hey, i also play zoom25 2tables and our approaches and issues seem very similar. good luck :D
      Thanks. Good luck to you, too. :)
    • rootakashi
      rootakashi
      Silver
      Joined: 01.03.2011 Posts: 2,494
      Originally posted by Schnitzelfisch
      Hi rootakashi,

      I'll be helping you out in this Boot Camp with topics like procrastination, motivation, laziness, productivity, focus while playing, putting in more volume/studying, creating habits that stick, etc.

      You mentioned that a big issue of yours is motivation.

      Could you please tell me:

      1) A bit more details about this. Which are the things that you ARE motivated to do and which are those which you aren't?
      2) What did you try so far to resolve this issue?
      3) What worked and what didn't?

      Thank you,

      -Primoz
      Hi, Primoz.

      I'm motivated to sleep and eat... and nothing else...
      Joke. :D

      Well, I've been thinking about your questions since you asked. And I also watched some of your videos and yesterday I visited your coaching. And I even wrote a long answer. But when I finished, I've suddenly understood, that I've just answered all my questions and I have no more questions to you.

      What did I mean when say that the courses like this increases my motivation? I noticed that my motivation is higher when I work with other people. As I already said in my previous post, I regularly discuss and evaluate played hands with other regs. I found some friends here, at pokerstrategy, and now we work together to improve our game. It really motivates a lot. And it's also a reason why courses like this motivates me - I can discuss my problems with coach and other people.

      I also noticed some other things that motivate me. And by now my motivation rose like a kite. It's no longer my issue. So you already helped me. Thank you, Primoz.

      P.S. I hope in the next boot camp I'll write that I've reached all of my goals and prove that this is not just a words.
    • Schnitzelfisch
      Schnitzelfisch
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.11.2008 Posts: 4,952
      Awesome! From your writing now I can see that you're definitely on the right path :) . Please send me an e-mail in a month or so to let my know about your progress. If you have any other questions/issues, please write them down here so that I can help you out now that you still have the access to me :) .
    • ErikStenqvist
      ErikStenqvist
      Global
      Joined: 14.01.2013 Posts: 431
      Hey again rootakashi!

      So after reading that great post I'll try to give you my perspective on it and what I think is a good approach.

      First of all since you struggle so much with playing 4-8 tables it's a good idea to look at why you are struggling with it in the first place. I know putting in a ton of hands every month is pretty much essential to playing poker professionally, but multi tabling and high volume is a skill that needs certain properties. By that I mean that instead of pushing super hard to grind many tables and forcing yourself to put in a lot of hands with low quality then it will never work in the long run. Your total amount of hands per month is a reflection of how many hands the pokerplayer you are is able to put in on average. So instead of looking at the result and try and change that you should try and removing or unlearn the leaks that prevent you from putting in hands. While also practicing on increasing focus, concentration, and practicing multi tabling. My advice is to play as many tables as you can without making mistakes and then add in one extra table and play that amount until you get comfortable.

      If you get restless playing few tables and that restlessness makes you start more tables and your quality of play drop dramatically then what needs to be looked at the restlessness and try to deal with that. I highly recommenced regular meditation and mindfulness practice if you aren't already doing it. This will also help with focus and concentration.

      When it comes to the decision making process then it sounds like you might have a tendency to over analyze spots where you might not need to. To multitable effectively you have to sacrifice time spent on each hand. This can cause problems for some guys if they, like you say, feel they made a mistake if they didn't take all factors into consideration. The fear of making a mistake can be really hard to overcome if it's not clearly identified. Do you feel this is a problem for you?

      I would begin by choosing one thing and focus on that. What do you think would be the most beneficial thing for you to work on actively?
      And what can you add into your poker routine to help you deal with these issues?