Help Constructing Solid 3bet Ranges vs Unknowns

    • metza
      metza
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      This is a pretty weak part of my game atm that I am going to be working on, I will be constructing what I think are appropriate ranges and explain why hands are going in the range, since I don't want to know what exact chart to play, but why I am making the decisions and if there are any fundamental errors in my thought processes.

      Pink/Red = 3b/5b Green = 3b/f Blue = cold call

      MP 3bets vs unknown UTG

      This is for 8bb sizing vs 3bb open.



      EDIT: I actually made a mistake here, meant to put KQo rather than AJs. I don't think it makes a huge difference, except in number of combos being 3bet as a bluff in relation to value 3bets. I think KQo is probably better as a blocker 3bet than AJs, though AJs plays slightly better in this range imo.

      Reasoning:

      I am not very happy to get in QQ/AK vs UTG readless so I have chosen to flat these, making my value 3betting range only KK+. While my 3bet bluffing range is actually a little unbalanced in that 70% of my 3bets are bluffs, the overall 3bet is just 3% which isn't wide at all and shouldn't invite UTG to target it with loose 4bets which most unknowns won't be doing too much anyway, especially since our 3bet bluffs block both their value hands and their 4bet blocker-bluffs. If we start getting reads that they are 4betting wide UTG vs MP we can start jamming AQo and they still won't have a profitable call w QQ @35% equity vs {KK+,AQo}

      Cold calling range is capped but it is also pretty strong so I don't think its hugely vulnerable but I might be wrong on that. I think possibly I could call a bit wider, but I don't think there is really any need to defend wider and it can just be something that is implemented once we have more reads on UTG RFI.

      I feel like AQs might be slightly higher EV as a call than as a 3bet bluff but I am not too sure about it and think its really close. AQo I don't feel like I could play profitably IP vs unknown UTG range. Not too sure about pocket pairs but I feel like maybe 77 is getting kinda dicey without reads.

      Any thoughts/corrections would be greatly appreciated.
  • 5 replies
    • QooQoo
      QooQoo
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.11.2013 Posts: 131
      1
    • metza
      metza
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      Nobody else is interested/knowledgeable about this? Cool. :f_cry:
    • SgtJackColt
      SgtJackColt
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.03.2011 Posts: 700
      Maybe they just dont want to expose their own gameplans. ;)
      I'm originally a fullring player. Within my ongoing change to shorthanded I constructed a preflop basic gameplan.

      My MP vs UTG Range looks pretty similar:



      If Villain is very tight I add more pockets and suited connectors, cause of more implieds.

      Against more loose and aggro players my range looks like this:



      If UTG is just loose and not aggro, I put AKo and QQ into my calling range.

      Also I like to protect my range and call some combos of AA and KK.

      I hope this kinda helps you. :)

      Since I'm new to that gameplan topic too, maybe a more experienced player could give some thoughts about this?
    • metza
      metza
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      Yeah, interesting that you choose 98s as 3bet, I think that's makes it easier to play aggressively on a wide range of flops and is probably a good idea vs good opponents.

      I think you're probably right about why people are not discussing, but I am not really so interested in the what but the why of the ranges anyway. Not like discussing this is gonna make the games even more 'too tough than they already are haha.

      Is there any reason you think KQs-T9s is a flat and not a fold pre? I guess they play pretty well, but UTGs range is strong and uncapped while ours is capped (though we do have position)...
    • SgtJackColt
      SgtJackColt
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.03.2011 Posts: 700
      Yes they just play well and you almost always hit a flop with them. I think if Villain is very aggro and doesn't like to fold or if there are very aggro players behind us, I'm more inclined to fold these kinda hands, cause either I haven't got fold equity when raising my backdoor flush+straight sth like that or I often have to fold to squeezes.