folding KK riv vs tight FR player 3bet pott.

    • stttNNN
      stttNNN
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.07.2010 Posts: 1,333
      First time im making this kind of play against a real tight player. he is 3beting me 3% and im asuming he can do this tighatare when we are opening first in UTG. all this players are usuly fullring players so it its not somekind om shorthanded game where this would be a super std call..

      I have dicouss this before and as I played this hand it should be pretty much "ok" play if FI is just barrel rivs with KK+. he is almost every singel time chking back JJ QQ in this spot and cant see him bluffing any kind of AK hands..

      so what do u guys say?

      $5/$10 No Limit Holdem
      5 Players
      Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

      Stacks:
      stttNNN (UTG) ($1,000) 100bb
      CO ($2,020) 202bb
      BTN ($1,640) 164bb
      SB ($2,360.02) 236bb
      BB ($415) 42bb

      Pre-Flop: ($15, 5 players) stttNNN is UTG K:heart: K:club:
      stttNNN raises to $35, 1 fold, BTN raises to $100, 2 folds, stttNNN calls $65

      Flop: 10:club: 6:diamond: 5:heart: ($215, 2 players)
      stttNNN checks, BTN bets $107.50, stttNNN calls $107.50

      Turn: 3:spade: ($419.26, 2 players)
      stttNNN checks, BTN bets $215, stttNNN calls $215

      River: 2:heart: ($840, 2 players)
      stttNNN checks, BTN bets $645, stttNNN folds

      Final Pot: $195
      stttNNN shows
      K:heart: K:club:

      BTN wins $1,485 (net +$417.50)

      stttNNN lost $387.50
  • 11 replies
    • mesisification
      mesisification
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.08.2011 Posts: 1,465
      How big is your sample size from villain? I would just stack off preflop even if he 3bets only 3%, he might stack off with that 3% range, I don't know. How much villain folds to 4bets?

      Postflop: Again, sample size should be pretty big if I'm folding the river. This spot is pretty easy to calculate: if villain shoves QQ for value then it's a call, if he doesn't then it's a fold. I'm assuming that villain is not bluffing here ever, which is pretty much true most likely.
    • stttNNN
      stttNNN
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.07.2010 Posts: 1,333
      i got more than 50k+ hands have been playing with him alot and cant see him stacking off AKo or QQ so if I 4bet i just get called by KK+ or showed wich sucks.. so i try to keep AK QQ+ still in hes range and almost 100% sure that he will chk down riv with QQ and bluffs.
    • mesisification
      mesisification
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.08.2011 Posts: 1,465
      Originally posted by stttNNN
      almost 100% sure that he will chk down riv with QQ and bluffs.
      Then it's wp obviously. :)
    • YohanN7
      YohanN7
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2009 Posts: 4,086
      As I see it it's HJ vs BU in a shorthanded game whether they are full-ring players or not. If you have 50k hands on this guy, he can't be all that inexperienced with poker and limit himself to AA only for 3-betting + 3-barreling on the button in a 5-handed game on a board that you surely have missed (he would have heard from TTT by the river).

      He is surely aware of the fact that there are only 5 players, and that you have an extreme respect for his range. Then if he uses this knowledge or not is something we don't know. I would. Poker players that nitty that never bluff go broke sooner or later. This guy isn't broke after 50k hands.
    • FFRRAANNKKIIEE
      FFRRAANNKKIIEE
      Silver
      Joined: 30.12.2010 Posts: 3,107
      Originally posted by YohanN7
      As I see it it's HJ vs BU in a shorthanded game whether they are full-ring players or not. If you have 50k hands on this guy, he can't be all that inexperienced with poker and limit himself to AA only for 3-betting + 3-barreling on the button in a 5-handed game on a board that you surely have missed (he would have heard from TTT by the river).

      He is surely aware of the fact that there are only 5 players, and that you have an extreme respect for his range. Then if he uses this knowledge or not is something we don't know. I would. Poker players that nitty that never bluff go broke sooner or later. This guy isn't broke after 50k hands.
      +1

      I also think that any regular would change his 3bet ranges when 5handed vs FR, I think you gave him too much respect maybe.
    • booomm
      booomm
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.03.2011 Posts: 677
      is this another sick joke :f_biggrin: ???

      4b/call all day, as played slam dunk call no matter what, this is 5handed after all, he can't be retarded to the point that he only 3b/5b AA 5handed.
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,910
      If he is really that nitty, you MUST 4bet pre, since even a nit has AQ and AK in their BTN 3Bet range

      Whether you 4Bet shove or make it 25-30 BB is up to you.
      If he folds, he had Ax or JJ-QQ, if he calls and the flop has an A, you can then exit gracefully if you like.

      Disclaimer: I am NOT a coach!

      Best of luck,
      --VS
    • Saren113
      Saren113
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.03.2009 Posts: 2,867
      I Would like to know villians WTSD% and W$ASD.

      Anc btw calling that turn to fold that river is just to burn money in my eyes. You should have taken your decision on the turn tbh.
    • OoT4NKoO
      OoT4NKoO
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.10.2012 Posts: 92
      What do you think your range and table image looks like to him?
    • mesisification
      mesisification
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.08.2011 Posts: 1,465
      Yeah after reading other comments I agree that we should either 4bet/call preflop or atleast calldown postflop. I didn't take into account the fact that villains stats are mostly from FR and we're playing 5-handed now. I think you're line is good if this was 9-handed and you were opening from UTG.
    • paulmoras
      paulmoras
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.04.2014 Posts: 41
      dont think we can fold here lol...