betfred support negative feedback

    • Kapurs
      Kapurs
      Basic
      Joined: 10.04.2014 Posts: 78
      Hello, i just wanted share my experience with ipoker support with my withdraw. I can't post images so i will just link to them.

      I tried use pokerstrategy promotion for free pokerranger using betfred but they said i am not affiliated by pokerstrategy (even i was sure i downloaded using pokerstrategy link) so i immediately was going to withdraw from room.

      I deposited with mastercard and was not able withdraw to it back and wanted withdraw to skrill. I was not expecting it be possible but i was very happy when they said it is.

      http://i59.tinypic.com/tyfs.jpg

      Ok, after 3 days not having my skrill account credited i used they live support again.

      First agent said i just need deposit 10 eur with skrill and then withdraw it. So i done it but in middle of conversation new agent come and said it not possible.

      http://i60.tinypic.com/mvn98m.jpg
      http://i57.tinypic.com/2qlzc5y.jpg

      It probably was somewhere deep in they terms of service it not possible or similar but i was expecting support members already know them and don't go over this.
      I suppose i will no play at betfred that much anymore.
  • 14 replies
    • Kapurs
      Kapurs
      Basic
      Joined: 10.04.2014 Posts: 78
      So some updates, already chatting with support team every 1-2 days, still...

      [ ] Money withdraw

      [x] Annoyed
      [x] Need change tomorrow playing routine
      [x] JamesR already know me when i come to support chat

      http://i62.tinypic.com/oqg1ld.jpg
    • AlvisR
      AlvisR
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.02.2009 Posts: 656
      ipoker network has this problem when people puts in some money and soon after wants to withdraw. Its mainly because you probably got somewhat of bonuses to clear and thats why you cant withdraw all your money you have.
    • Kapurs
      Kapurs
      Basic
      Joined: 10.04.2014 Posts: 78
      No any bonuses was used, got some tickets but never used them. Played some heads up, not get tracked by pokerstrategy and at moment when wanted withdraw had 48 eur initial deposit with 2 eur loss (without any bonus money), then got asked deposit 10 eur via skrill.
    • UPAY4DINNER
      UPAY4DINNER
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.09.2009 Posts: 21,926
      Hey kapurs,

      Have you spoken with our customer support about your issues? Maybe we can help!


      Regards,
      Gary
    • Kapurs
      Kapurs
      Basic
      Joined: 10.04.2014 Posts: 78
      Send support ticket to PS team.

      Got another confusing support message via email from them after asked if them get my email with bank details.

      "Yes your information was received, however to withdraw you first need to make a deposit."

      http://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg604/kamitis777/email_zps2f33662b.jpg

      They troll me here or they just have no idea what other support team members are doing and what has been previous discussions with me?
    • AlvisR
      AlvisR
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.02.2009 Posts: 656
      these tickets are counted as somewhat bonus from them. when i couple months ago played around with everest i deposited, won some money, used tickets they gave me, then tried to withdraw back to skrill and i couldnt withdraw all money because part of it were somewhat reserved for some time. Talking with support sorted it out for that day, but i didnt withdraw, soon after i played a bit more and it happened again (reserved money and couldnt withdraw all). Then contacted them and withdraw immediately. :)

      GLGL!
    • Kapurs
      Kapurs
      Basic
      Joined: 10.04.2014 Posts: 78
      Yeah was scared of that they will want me to rake ticket value before withdraw or similar and not used them for that reason before was sure i am tracked by pokerstrategy what wasn't case this time, so it seem there should not be any issue with tickets if they are not used.
    • tonypmm
      tonypmm
      Silver
      Joined: 11.01.2009 Posts: 3,853
      No matter how this case ends (gl!), I find it a good idea (for your future deposits) to upload money first from a Mastercard to Skrill and only then from Skrill to a poker room:
      Direct deposits from a card are too uncomfortable, especially if you're going to play at many rooms, exactly because 1) you can't withdraw back to the card (and you'll need to deposit via an alternative method first to then cash out via it), 2) you'll usually be asked to provide too many financial documents to prove that you're the holder of the card and not a fraud (a bank statement or even a printed and signed 'credit card verification form') on top of standard ID and address proofs, while the only thing (and only for large withdrawals) you'll need to prove your ownership of the Skrill account to a poker room will be a screenshot.

      Then you'll of course have to provide and verify bank details in order to cash out from Skrill to the bank, but it's done once, no matter at how many rooms you play. So I think there's less paperwork this way.

      As played, as far as I understand the rules... In your shoes, I'd send them the following documents:

      1) Proofs of your ownership of the card:
      Non-UK Issued Credit Cards

      Visa

      For Visa cards issued in other countries, Betfred.com will make payment to the credit card account which was used for the original deposit where the issuer allows it.

      MasterCard

      We cannot process any withdrawals to an International MasterCard. If you deposited funds using an International MasterCard, Betfred.com will process your withdrawal to an alternative method.

      Customers may have to provide Betfred.com with documentation before any alternate method can be used to return funds:

      A copy of the front and back of all cards on the account.
      A copy of your passport.
      A copy of a recent bank statement.

      (See Betfred's FAQ on depositing and withdrawing http://www.betfred.com/help/faq/general ). The bank statement will automatically serve as a proof of your address (if it's typed on the statement; otherwise attach also a recent utility bill to your name or just any remotely official recent document that shows both your name and address).

      2) A proof of your ownership of the Skrill account (a screenshot showing your address and email when you're logged into the Skrill account).

      3) Maybe you'll indeed also need to deposit €10 via Skrill, just to make withdrawals to Skrill possible (that's the way their automated system works). Before withdrawing, though, you'll need play it through (i.e. rake €10 more) to avoid fees. However, if you don't want to play it through, then they should allow you to withdraw anyway but with a fee withheld (that's a compensation for the fee Skrill charged from Betfred for your deposit, which is absorbed by Betfred if you rake enough, i.e. generate revenue for them).

      However, I believe that their request to withdraw via bank transfer (not Skrill) is nonsense in this case. As they can't process withdrawals via your original deposit method, they should allow you to withdraw via any possible method as soon as you provide them with sufficient documents.
    • Kapurs
      Kapurs
      Basic
      Joined: 10.04.2014 Posts: 78
      [x] - Already done before this thread had been started.

      During first day after deposit got asked (by asking i mean closing my tables while i am playing, folding my hands and show message i need contact support via email):

      [x] Sent front and back of my MasterCard hiding needed numbers
      [x] Sent copy of my passport
      [x] Sent internet bill to prove my address

      All documents got accepted and no more had been asked.

      [x] Deposited 10eur when 1st support agent asked to do it to withdraw via Skrill full cashier available sum. I specifically asked "i should do 10 eur deposit via skrill and then withdraw all?" to make sure and he said clear "Yes, raivis" and i done it in minutes while we was chatting. See image below for full chat window.
      http://i60.tinypic.com/mvn98m.jpg
      [x]After already made Skrill deposit in middle of conversation new support agent said by law they need balance out deposit methods contradicting last support agent. If i understand it right they explanation it like, i made 50 eur with direct bank deposit (credit card) and now they can withdraw to any other new deposit method (in this case skrill) only when they have returned 50 eur to credit card and it balanced direct deposit/withdraws out. See images below for full chat window.
      http://i60.tinypic.com/mvn98m.jpg
      http://i57.tinypic.com/2qlzc5y.jpg


      Skrill, neteller def is easier options in most rooms.
    • tonypmm
      tonypmm
      Silver
      Joined: 11.01.2009 Posts: 3,853
      Edit: read my next post first...

      __________________________________________

      OK, I think, strictly speaking, a copy of the front and back of the credit card is not a sufficient proof of your ownership of it. One of the reasons is that the name printed on its front doesn't need to coincide with the passport name of the holder. So theoretically someone else could make a card with your name typed on the front and then hand it to you. Or you could steal it from someone with the same name who hadn't signed it, and put your signature on the back :f_biggrin:

      Anyway, as per the above quotes, you're additionally required to provide a bank statement for the account attached to the card to verify that the card was used to move money from your account and you authorised that transaction.

      Afaik, many poker sites will readily accept a screenshot of a bank statement (for the account the card is tied to, showing that very deposit to Betfred) from the internet bank facility of the bank that has issued the card. In an extreme case, you'll need to visit the bank and request a paper statement there.

      I believe this document is needed anyway, regardless of the method to be used for withdrawal. I can't see why Betfred has to prohibit withdrawing less than £100 to Skrill - you will have proved ownership of both accounts so you'll just be moving a small sum of money between your own legit accounts and there's no big money laundering - but if Betfred insists that the withdrawal should be a bank transfer (except €10 going back to Skrill), obey to save the nerves. Sometimes it's better to accept a bit of unfairness than fight it.

      A good news is that
      Betfred.com will pay for one free standard bank withdrawal every 28 days.

      (I'm not sure if they'll keep this promise as you haven't played much, but the standard fee - the one that's deducted from additional withdrawals - is £12, not that grave.)

      Other gambling sites have similar requirements, say, that's what Ladbrokes say (scroll down there):
      Because of restrictions put in place by MasterCard, refunds are only available back to UK MasterCards. Non-UK MasterCard users will need to register their bank details to withdraw their winnings

      (by 'registration' they, of course, mean a proof of the bank account ownership too).

      Anyway, never ever deposit directly from a Mastercard again because it's always such a pain (its issuers have unilaterally prohibited withdrawing from gambling sites back to Mastercards).
    • tonypmm
      tonypmm
      Silver
      Joined: 11.01.2009 Posts: 3,853
      Also, as you care about productivity, I'll remind you about a time-saving method that's used by myself and other PLO players who can't be bothered to submit docs to withdraw 2-digit sums (remains of busted siterolls). That's obviously 'running it up' :f_biggrin:

      I mean, there's even no need to play poker for it, just bet the entire balance on a small house edge casino game like Jacks or Better, accepting double-up bets as long as possible. >90% of the time, you'll bust the entire balance, no longer need to submit docs and argue with the support and will be able to concentrate on more useful things :f_cool: They're just too lazy themselves to request docs from busto account holders that wagered insignificant amounts or accuse them of money laundering - they value their own time too.

      Otherwise, you'll run it up to a sum that's really worth caring about (high 3 digits), but as the truth is on your side (your bank account and card are legit, the problem is only that Betfred is misunderstanding you, needs proofs, etc.), you won't lose it, will just spend several more hours providing proofs and arguing with the support, but that will happen <10% of the time, and your overall EV will be about neutral.
    • Kapurs
      Kapurs
      Basic
      Joined: 10.04.2014 Posts: 78
      Tony, it sounds like you are betfred team who come here and want me to gamble casino machines. :D

      But anyway mastercard deposits now will scare me for live.
    • Kapurs
      Kapurs
      Basic
      Joined: 10.04.2014 Posts: 78
      It seem solved now, will see if there is no any other issue.

      http://i57.tinypic.com/jfc8lc.jpg
    • tonypmm
      tonypmm
      Silver
      Joined: 11.01.2009 Posts: 3,853
      Well, Betfred's support has strengthened the reputation of being (reportedly) one of the worst among those of major iPoker skins...

      Let's wait for the money to hit the bank acct, but the progress of the case has indeed been positive =)