Postflop raise sizing

    • Th334
      Th334
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.11.2012 Posts: 971
      Hi guys

      I've been away from poker for a while, and now I'm trying to catch up on the basics.

      I can't seem to find anywhere how much do people raise postflop. What I do now is just use the same 1/2 - 2/3 - 3/4 - 1/1 pot size guidelines I would apply if I was just betting.

      Example:
      We have an A A overpair on the 5 9 T flop, which is drawy. The pot is $10, and our only villain decides to donk $3. This isn't enough for me, because I don't want to give him good odds, so I want to raise. How much?

      What I would do:
      – the new pot now is $10+$3=$13
      – so I raise by the 3/4 of the new pot, which is $9.75 on top
      – this gives the villain 2.3:1 pot odds for a call, which he won't have with his draw

      Is that precisely what I'm supposed to be doing from the bet sizing perspective?

      Thank you very much, you're awesome! ;)
  • 5 replies
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,910
      Hi, Th334,
      I saw recently in a video of a coaching session where the coach spoke about this.

      Unfortunately, I can't remember which video it was.

      I *think* it was one by W34z3l, though.

      If I remember it correctly, the plan related to stack size.

      The idea is to size your raises so that you can get it in with a pot-sized bet in the river.

      Assuming villain comes along, of course.

      Best of luck,
      --VS
    • Th334
      Th334
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.11.2012 Posts: 971
      Originally posted by VorpalF2F
      The idea is to size your raises so that you can get it in with a pot-sized bet in the river.
      Hi VS,

      Yeah, that's a good point. It might seem a bit counter-intuitive, but I wasn't talking about raises where we want to eventually stack, I was talking about pot-control raises :D It only happens on micro limits, and only when fish bets some ridiculously small amount. To call is not enough for me, but I don't necessarily have a hand I want to play for stacks with. And now I need to figure out how much to raise his bet.

      But I see that there're no set rules or consensus, so I'll use whatever judgement I have at each particular hand :)

      Thanks,
      —Th334
    • 4Xample
      4Xample
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.07.2014 Posts: 18
      Why would you want to pot control w/ AA on T95s? There are so many hands that you beat like draws, weaker pairs and you only lose to sets and two pair (T9 - I assume he doesn't have T5 or 95 in his range).

      Your raise size should depend on how wet the flop is, so here I would make a nice juicy pot sized bet and get it in.
      Don't make it too complicated with exact raise sizes for every situation. You can even bet or raise according to your hand strength and nobody will notice, but if you want to be balanced just bet/raise big on wet boards and bet/raise smaller on dry boards with both bluffs and value hands.
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,910
      Originally posted by Th334
      It only happens on micro limits, and only when fish bets some ridiculously small amount. To call is not enough for me, but I don't necessarily have a hand I want to play for stacks with. And now I need to figure out how much to raise his bet.
      I think the phrase is "click it back" -- in other words, click the raise button, and re-raise his "ridiculously small bet" by the same amount.

      These small bets show a polarized range -- they either have the air and are trying to bluff cheaply, or they have the nutz an trying to induce a bluff, or just collect some money.

      Another tactic is to just ignore it, and bet what you would have bet if they had not bet at all.

      Cheers,
      --VS
    • Th334
      Th334
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.11.2012 Posts: 971
      Originally posted by 4Xample
      Why would you want to pot control w/ AA on T95s? There are so many hands that you beat like draws, weaker pairs and you only lose to sets and two pair (T9 - I assume he doesn't have T5 or 95 in his range).

      Your raise size should depend on how wet the flop is, so here I would make a nice juicy pot sized bet and get it in.
      Don't make it too complicated with exact raise sizes for every situation. You can even bet or raise according to your hand strength and nobody will notice, but if you want to be balanced just bet/raise big on wet boards and bet/raise smaller on dry boards with both bluffs and value hands.
      No, sorry, of course I don't want to pot-control here, I forgot about the first example I gave when giving the second one :)

      Yup, the latter. That's what I'm doing, pretty much. Wet board, and/or multiple opponents, and/or the board hits cold-calling range well --> I bet or raise 3/4 - 1/1 pot. If it's dry, one high card, or paired, I just bet 1/2 - 2/3 pot. I just wasn't sure what to do when raising, but I can use the same guidelines in order to give the villain the same pot odds for a call as if I was just betting, not raising. I do tend to raise to 1/2 pot more often though, because it is a big raise still, if you calculate the pot-size raise correctly.