AA multiways

    • Gadgaard
      Gadgaard
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.06.2012 Posts: 124
      CO is a standard reg.
      MP is an unknown with a vpip of 23 after 39 hands.

      The plan:
      Preflop. we call the 4bet shove so that player 5 might call TT,JJ,QQ,KK, AQs, AK

      Flop. we're not scared of anything and check in order to look weak, and if villain checkback he might hit something good on turn and pay us off.

      Turn: betting is an option, but it'll most of the time look like we wanted to trap him with ak on the flop, and he'll fold a big part of his range, so i decide to check and bet river if he checkback. only thing we're potentially afraid of is aq :heart: , ak :heart: .

      River: we bet for value and most likely will get called by KK, QQ, AK, AQs, while JJ might shove and TT prob fold. He decides to minraise and I dont think we can shove for value, since he only call with JJ and AQ :heart: , AK :heart:

      Party, $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      Hero (SB): $245.36 (245.4 bb)
      BB: $100.50 (100.5 bb)
      UTG: $127.84 (127.8 bb)
      MP: $186 (186 bb)
      CO: $48 (48 bb)
      BTN: $32 (32 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is SB with A A
      UTG folds, MP raises to $4, CO calls $4, BTN folds, Hero raises to $16, BB folds, MP calls $12, CO raises to $48 and is all-in, Hero calls $32, MP calls $32

      Flop: ($145) 3 A 8 (3 players, 1 is all-in)
      Hero checks, MP checks

      Turn: ($145) J (3 players, 1 is all-in)
      Hero checks, MP checks

      River: ($145) 4 (3 players, 1 is all-in)
      Hero bets $40, MP raises to $80, Hero calls $40


  • 8 replies
    • dannywratten
      dannywratten
      Gold
      Joined: 11.05.2010 Posts: 1,462
      I guess checking flop is an option, but I'm never checking turn as well...
      Do you think he is folding to one bet with JJ-KK? I doubt it, & we also have value vs AK.

      You're never going to get your stack in checking twice.

      I would just bet/bet/shove
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,910
      Note that I don't play NL100

      If there is value to be had, how will you get it without betting?

      If you're against a flush draw -- especially OTT with 2 flush draws -- why give him a free card?

      OTOH, with all the dead money in the pot, your FE is somewhat reduced.

      Interesting spot.

      --VS




    • Gadgaard
      Gadgaard
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.06.2012 Posts: 124
      Hello guys :)

      I appreciate your answers but im essentially waiting for a coach to discuss it with, if I had to discuss it with every single player i'd take too long.
    • lnternet
      lnternet
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.06.2012 Posts: 782
      Since the pot is protected on the flop, you can't bluff, unless you beat the all-in players range by a significant amount. (No point in bluffing and then losing the pot anyways to the all-in player).

      Because of that, your value range and bluff range are very high up, and your sizing should be small. You should rarely slowplay and often protection bet, as villain shouldn't be betting often (or big) himself.

      Just bet the flop for 1/5 pot. Then turn with dual-FD perhaps 1/3 pot. Checking twice is fairly bad, as he has no inclination to bet a FD or SD, because the pot is protected. Again, semi-bluffing is not possible for him! So you should bet yourself.

      River bet is fine.

      Against the raise on the river.. would be the sickest bluff ever. I'm a bit afraid he may be raising a rivered set like that.. but seems unlikely. I think it's a fold. Any stats? If he is a confirmed solid player it's a fold, if not, tough spot, probably call as he may be "stupid".
    • ETBrooD
      ETBrooD
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.09.2009 Posts: 2,421
      I'm surprised that the preflop situation hasn't been talked about yet. Why don't we ignore the no-5bet-rule here and just stick it in with KK+, AK, or even QQ? I'm not sure squeezing JJ with such awkward stacksizes is the best idea anyway.
      And what about the 3-bet sizing? Isn't it too small?
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,910
      Originally posted by ETBrooD
      I'm surprised that the preflop situation hasn't been talked about yet. Why don't we ignore the no-5bet-rule here and just stick it in with KK+, AK, or even QQ? I'm not sure squeezing JJ with such awkward stacksizes is the best idea anyway.
      And what about the 3-bet sizing? Isn't it too small?
      Hi, ETBrooD,
      No-5Bet-rule? I'm not sure I know what you mean.
      The squeeze is 4x the previous raise-and-call amount. Isn't that about right?
      The 4Bet is from a shorty, so now we're playing MP for the side pot with effective stacks of 186 BB with the extra boost from the shorty who is now all-in.

      That extra will be very, very attractive, so when it comes to us there is 85.50 in the pot.
      A 5-bet seems pretty much mandatory, but then NL 100 is out of my league...

      Cheers,
      VS

      I don't
    • dannywratten
      dannywratten
      Gold
      Joined: 11.05.2010 Posts: 1,462
      Originally posted by ETBrooD
      I'm surprised that the preflop situation hasn't been talked about yet. Why don't we ignore the no-5bet-rule here and just stick it in with KK+, AK, or even QQ? I'm not sure squeezing JJ with such awkward stacksizes is the best idea anyway.
      And what about the 3-bet sizing? Isn't it too small?
      I think calling the shove > 5betting here.
      MP is probably folding most of his range if we 5b, & we are 180bb effective, so getting it in with AK is prob not good. I would play the same pre. (but rather bet/bet/shove post)

      Also squeeze size seems std to me.
    • Kruppe
      Kruppe
      Black
      Joined: 20.02.2008 Posts: 2,144
      i agree with lnternet that we should just make minibets postflop

      river: really weird, as imo all the hands you mentioned, JJ,AKhh,AQhh, are extremely unlikely to check flop and turn. but i guess he had one of those as those are the only ones you listed? was it AQhh? just looking at the hh i would have thought KQhh is much more likely, and maybe a weird 44