Trying to build my PF ranges - CO

    • msnek
      msnek
      Silver
      Joined: 01.10.2008 Posts: 866
      I am trying to build some solid basic ranges for 6max NL10 CG.. By basic I mean I want to have some starting point and make those ranges wider or thinner depending on action, dynamics, stacks and villain(s).
      Is this one ok ? Is there something you really dislike ? If so why ? Thank you very much :)

      Any color = open raise
      Orange/brown = + flat
      Red = + 3bet

  • 12 replies
    • LookAwayNow
      LookAwayNow
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.06.2011 Posts: 912
      I wouldn't add all those off-suited aces because you're gonna get yourself in terrible dominated spots if one of the 3 guys behind you is calling. It's gonna cost you in the long run. I would say A9o+ as a standard or even ATo+. The rest of the chart looks fine to me. Maybe add the Q7s/J7s/T7s to your stealing range. And get rid of some off-suited Kings, I would prefer KTo+ or even KJo+.
    • msnek
      msnek
      Silver
      Joined: 01.10.2008 Posts: 866
      Hmmm, are you sure ? This is 6max not fullring.
    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 1,356
      w34z3l's 6max walkthrough - (microstakes edition)

      CO 22+, A2s+, K6s+, Q7s+, J7s+, T7s+, 97s+, 86s+, 75s+, 64s+, 54s, ATo+, KJo+, QJo, JTo, T9o
    • msnek
      msnek
      Silver
      Joined: 01.10.2008 Posts: 866
      Originally posted by LemOn36
      w34z3l's 6max walkthrough - (microstakes edition)

      CO 22+, A2s+, K6s+, Q7s+, J7s+, T7s+, 97s+, 86s+, 75s+, 64s+, 54s, ATo+, KJo+, QJo, JTo, T9o
      Why ?
    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 1,356
      http://www.pokerstrategy.com/strategy/bss/1671/1/
      http://www.pokerstrategy.com/video/32673/
    • msnek
      msnek
      Silver
      Joined: 01.10.2008 Posts: 866
      Originally posted by LookAwayNowMaybe add the Q7s/J7s/T7s to your stealing range. And get rid of some off-suited Kings, I would prefer KTo+ or even KJo+.
      Ok thx for opinion. Could u try elaborate more the reasoning and contra arguments for those changes ? Thx !
    • LookAwayNow
      LookAwayNow
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.06.2011 Posts: 912
      If you're gonna open K7o+ you're gonna get yourself in a lot of bad spots because the calling-ranges of the people behind you will consist of dominated Kx. You stand the chance of seeing a flop out of position vs a dominating Kx-range. The reason you're opening K5s and not K9o is because K5s has the flush potential and has a lot of post-flop playabillity. i.e.; the chance that you hit something that has equity to semi-bluff on a flop is way bigger with K5s than it is with K9o.

      It's the same reasoning why we open A4s but not A8o. A4s has a flush possibility AND a straight possibility, that's also the reason why we like to 4-bet-bluff with these hands.

      I'm adding Q7s/J7s/T7s to my stealing range for the same reasoning. Also T7s has a straight-possibility. Please keep in mind that the amount of hands you can open on each position at the table is not only dependent on how people behind you play back at you but it's especially dependent of your post-flop-skills.
    • IPtkv
      IPtkv
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.08.2011 Posts: 107
      My personal opinion is just to stick with Weasel's ranges. The reason why is simply, because they work perfectly at micros. And if you open so wide from CO your post flop game should be really good.


      Yordi
    • msnek
      msnek
      Silver
      Joined: 01.10.2008 Posts: 866
      Originally posted by LemOn36
      http://www.pokerstrategy.com/strategy/bss/1671/1/
      http://www.pokerstrategy.com/video/32673/
      Well .. thanks .. but in the article there is nothing about why particular hands from particular positions are better than some other. And unfortunately I don't have access to that video :(
    • msnek
      msnek
      Silver
      Joined: 01.10.2008 Posts: 866
      Originally posted by LookAwayNow
      If you're gonna open K7o+ you're gonna get yourself in a lot of bad spots because the calling-ranges of the people behind you will consist of dominated Kx. You stand the chance of seeing a flop out of position vs a dominating Kx-range. The reason you're opening K5s and not K9o is because K5s has the flush potential and has a lot of post-flop playabillity. i.e.; the chance that you hit something that has equity to semi-bluff on a flop is way bigger with K5s than it is with K9o.

      It's the same reasoning why we open A4s but not A8o. A4s has a flush possibility AND a straight possibility, that's also the reason why we like to 4-bet-bluff with these hands.

      I'm adding Q7s/J7s/T7s to my stealing range for the same reasoning. Also T7s has a straight-possibility. Please keep in mind that the amount of hands you can open on each position at the table is not only dependent on how people behind you play back at you but it's especially dependent of your post-flop-skills.
      Thanks for answer. Well I get your reasoning about Kx and Ax hands. I see it same way ofc. But that's we could easily said that for other positions. BTN for example. Like K9o on the BTN ?! Don't open that there. K5s is better .. etc. etc.

      So why is this so loose on CO for a standard range and why is it ok on BTN ? I know the general answer ofc, but my point is .. are you really sure there is such a big difference between CO and BTN so we can't open K9o profitably from CO ?
    • msnek
      msnek
      Silver
      Joined: 01.10.2008 Posts: 866
      By the way .. in many charts and ranges made by someone there are small pocketpairs already from UTG. I heard these are just not profitable (majority of the time). If so .. very little.
    • LookAwayNow
      LookAwayNow
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.06.2011 Posts: 912
      Because on CO you have the chance to see a flop out of position vs btn. And if you open from btn, you're always playing in position. :)