All in EV discrepancy

    • Wohmfg
      Wohmfg
      Silver
      Joined: 12.11.2009 Posts: 500
      If I look at my results graph for 11-15bbs in the Stack Size report, it shows I have an all in EV of 2036bbs over 71k hands. If I add the filter "Allin on River (or earlier)", I have an all in EV of 4274bbs over 6k hands.

      The "Allin on River (or earlier)" filter should contain every single all in hand. These are the only hands an all in EV can be calculated for. The 2 results graphs should show the exact same all in EV. I can't workout why there is a discrepancy.
  • 8 replies
    • tonypmm
      tonypmm
      Silver
      Joined: 11.01.2009 Posts: 3,853
      Originally posted by Wohmfg
      The "Allin on River (or earlier)" filter should contain every single all in hand. These are the only hands an all in EV can be calculated for.
      The bold sentence is wrong - the all-in EV is calculated for all non-all-in hands as well, for which it equals the actual amount of chips won (net), by definition.
    • Wohmfg
      Wohmfg
      Silver
      Joined: 12.11.2009 Posts: 500
      So what is the net won line?

      I'm using HEM2 btw.
    • tonypmm
      tonypmm
      Silver
      Joined: 11.01.2009 Posts: 3,853
      The net winnings = the (gross) winnings minus the total bet. That's the default way your winnings are calculated and displayed in graphs.

      E.g.

      PokerStars - $6.58+$0.42|10/20 NL (3 max) - Holdem - 3 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

      Hero (BTN): 500
      SB: 500
      BB: 500

      SB posts SB 10, BB posts BB 20

      Pre Flop: (pot: 30) Hero has K:club: 9:heart:

      Hero raises to 40, SB calls 30, BB calls 20

      Flop: (120, 3 players) A:club: K:spade: 9:diamond:
      SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets 80, fold, fold

      Hero wins 120 <--- gross amount won

      Total uncalled bet = 40
      Net amount won = 120 - 40 = 80
    • Wohmfg
      Wohmfg
      Silver
      Joined: 12.11.2009 Posts: 500
      Ok, and those chips would be counted as non-showdown winnings, correct? And they would not affect the all in EV line at all?

      So which hands exactly affect the all in EV line? In your example above, the chips would also add to the all in EV line?
    • Mandator
      Mandator
      Gold
      Joined: 02.02.2008 Posts: 363
      All those hands that end up in All in before river count for the All in EV. For example AA vs KK All in preflop is an 80/20 equity. Imagine the same hand in a $100 pot ($50 stack each player).
      According with the equity of your aces, the ammount you should win in the long term is $80 from the total pot. If your aces are cracked the AI ev will indicate that you should won $80 (gross amount won) and the real one wil indicate you lost $50.
    • Wohmfg
      Wohmfg
      Silver
      Joined: 12.11.2009 Posts: 500
      Sure, but that wouldn't explain the discrepancy in my original post.
    • Kyyberi
      Kyyberi
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 09.07.2010 Posts: 10,511
      The problem is that you haven't read the whole stat. It is not "all-in EV", it is "all-in EV adjusted winnings". So it contains every hand. From those where you are not all-in on turn or earlier, it counts the actual winnings. From all-in situations it doesn't count the actual winnings but your equity share (winning %).
    • Wohmfg
      Wohmfg
      Silver
      Joined: 12.11.2009 Posts: 500
      That clears it up, thanks!