Shove 100 bb v BvB 3b

  • 8 replies
    • mbml
      mbml
      Black
      Joined: 27.11.2008 Posts: 20,698
      Don't do it with any hands. You will usually perform better by making a small 4bet (AXo with weak kicker) or calling the 3bet (low pairs)
    • la55i
      la55i
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 27.01.2013 Posts: 7,140
      I wouldn't start shoving vs those guys. I think it is better to tighten our steal range a bit and start 4betting more (normal size).
    • Grezky99
      Grezky99
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.01.2012 Posts: 11
      I would not shove any hand. I do not thing that is profitable play in the long run. I agree with previous posts. 4bet more when you think you have the best hand.
    • hellraiser22
      hellraiser22
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.09.2007 Posts: 44
      If he is not folding to 4bets i would be shoving the hole 4bet-calling and 4bet-folding range at least.
    • DREAMC4T
      DREAMC4T
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.10.2009 Posts: 984
      Am I nuts or a genius if I want a 4b sh range here in addition to my normal call/fold/4b ranges? Say 22-66 which I dont really want to call oop and hands like A2-A9o. If the villain is 3b like 16-20% I estimate (without calcs, might be way off) I could shove these hands and show a profit. Or should I small 4b and fold all Ax and call with pp? Or 4b/f with them too?
    • NothingIsForSho
      NothingIsForSho
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.06.2014 Posts: 382
      You might be on to something you know, it doesn't sound that horrific. But it's more natural to just 4bet one range, and it'll be easier to construct.
    • metza
      metza
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      Originally posted by DREAMC4T
      Am I nuts or a genius if I want a 4b sh range here in addition to my normal call/fold/4b ranges? Say 22-66 which I dont really want to call oop and hands like A2-A9o. If the villain is 3b like 16-20% I estimate (without calcs, might be way off) I could shove these hands and show a profit. Or should I small 4b and fold all Ax and call with pp? Or 4b/f with them too?
      Problem is villain is usually gonna interpret these shoves correctly, as roughly the range that you've put up. So unless you do it with some big hands also (and lose a lot of value in the process) its not the most viable long term strategy. I feel like short term its not the best either, it may be +EV but you will get a better short term result by opening tight and punishing his 3bets with a flatting range that crushes his while also defending often enough, and polarized 4bet range. These kinda guys will not notice short term if you tighten up bvb.
    • DREAMC4T
      DREAMC4T
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.10.2009 Posts: 984
      Originally posted by metza
      Originally posted by DREAMC4T
      Am I nuts or a genius if I want a 4b sh range here in addition to my normal call/fold/4b ranges? Say 22-66 which I dont really want to call oop and hands like A2-A9o. If the villain is 3b like 16-20% I estimate (without calcs, might be way off) I could shove these hands and show a profit. Or should I small 4b and fold all Ax and call with pp? Or 4b/f with them too?
      Problem is villain is usually gonna interpret these shoves correctly, as roughly the range that you've put up. So unless you do it with some big hands also (and lose a lot of value in the process) its not the most viable long term strategy. I feel like short term its not the best either, it may be +EV but you will get a better short term result by opening tight and punishing his 3bets with a flatting range that crushes his while also defending often enough, and polarized 4bet range. These kinda guys will not notice short term if you tighten up bvb.
      Even if I tell them my shoving range of A9-A2o and 22-66 I don't see them making adjustments enough. I mean, I still have the more normal ranges aside from this one. What it could do is make them 3bet less, which is good for me. I think I'll try to implement this against the villains with like 13-14%+ BvB 3b and see how it plays out/how the adjust etc. Will update here in a week or two!