Uhm, well...:/

    • Paznecht
      Paznecht
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.01.2008 Posts: 78
      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      Hero:
      $1,90
      UTG:
      $10,61
      MP2:
      $4,79

      0,05/0,1 No-Limit Hold'em (10 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy Elephant 0.65 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is SB with K:heart: , K:spade:
      UTG calls $0,10, UTG1 calls $0,10, 2 folds, MP2 raises to $0,55, 3 folds, Hero raises to $1,90 (All-In), 3 folds, MP2 calls $1,35.

      Flop: ($4,10) 2:diamond: , J:heart: , 7:spade:
      Turn: ($4,10) 8:diamond:
      River: ($4,10) A:diamond: (2 players)


      Final Pot: $4,10

      Results:
      Hero shows a pair of kings (Kh Ks)
      MP2 shows a pair of aces (Qc As)

      MP2 wins with a pair of aces (Qc As)


      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      Hero:
      $1,90
      MP2:
      $13,60

      0,05/0,1 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy Elephant 0.65 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is SB with A:heart: , A:spade:
      UTG1 calls $0,10, 2 folds, MP2 raises to $0,50, 3 folds, Hero raises to $1,90 (All-In), BB folds, UTG1 calls $1,80, MP2 calls $1,40.

      Flop: ($5,80) 3:spade: , K:club: , 9:spade: (2 players)
      UTG1 bets $2,75, MP2 folds.

      Turn: ($8,55) 8:diamond:
      River: ($8,55) J:diamond: (2 players)


      Final Pot: $8,55

      Results:
      Hero shows a pair of aces (Ah As)
      UTG1 shows two pairs, kings and nines (Kh 9h)

      UTG1 wins with two pairs, kings and nines (Kh 9h)


      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      BB:
      $4,32
      Hero:
      $1,80
      CO:
      $19,03

      0,05/0,1 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy Elephant 0.65 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is MP1 with A:diamond: , K:club:
      2 folds, Hero raises to $0,40, 2 folds, CO calls $0,40, 2 folds, BB calls $0,30.

      Flop: ($1,25) 3:diamond: , K:spade: , J:diamond: (3 players)
      BB checks, Hero raises $1,40 (All-In), CO folds, BB calls $1,40.

      Turn: ($4,05) 9:club:
      River: ($4,05) 4:diamond: (2 players)


      Final Pot: $4,05

      Results:
      Hero shows a pair of kings (Ad Kc)
      BB shows two pairs, kings and jacks (Kd Jc)

      BB wins with two pairs, kings and jacks (Kd Jc)



      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      MP2:
      $9,52
      MP3:
      $2,58

      0,05/0,1 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy Elephant 0.65 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is UTG2 with A:spade: , A:club:
      UTG1 folds, Hero raises to $0,40, MP1 folds, MP2 calls $0,40, MP3 raises to $2,58 (All-In), 4 folds, Hero calls $1,30 (All-In), MP2 folds.

      Flop: ($4,83) T:spade: , 7:diamond: , J:club:
      Turn: ($4,83) K:club:
      River: ($4,83) K:diamond: (2 players)


      Final Pot: $4,83

      Results:
      Hero shows two pairs, aces and kings (As Ac)
      MP3 shows three of a kind, kings (Ad Kh)

      MP3 wins with three of a kind, kings (Ad Kh)


      And this one ...

      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      MP3:
      $10,73
      CO:
      $13,41
      Hero:
      $1,70

      0,05/0,1 No-Limit Hold'em (8 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy Elephant 0.65 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is BU with K:spade: , K:club:
      UTG2 raises to $0,20, 2 folds, MP3 calls $0,20, CO calls $0,20, Hero raises to $1,70 (All-In), 2 folds, UTG2 calls $1,50, MP3 calls $1,50, CO calls $1,50.

      Flop: ($6,95) J:diamond: , T:spade: , 6:club: (3 players)
      UTG2 bets $2,10, 2 folds.

      Turn: ($9,05) T:club:
      River: ($9,05) 8:spade: (2 players)


      Final Pot: $9,05

      it was ... like preflop :) )) .... flop :) )) turn ... :-/
      preflop, i pretty much thought i'm going to get some of my money back, that my swing is over ... but ...

      Results follow (highlight to see):
      Hero shows two pairs, kings and tens (Ks Kc)
      UTG2 shows three of a kind, tens (Ah Th)

      UTG2 wins with three of a kind, tens (Ah Th)


      And thats not all :/

      So, to summ up, ~2k hands i was steadily winning and then in something like ~500 hands i lost that. No change in strategy at all, just hands like this. In those past hands i was like -35BB/100


      *** all above was written few hour ago ***

      First i decided not to post this topic, just said myself, that it's normal, this happens and other guys have had much longer downswings (although my is not over yet). So i decided to take a little break and stop playing cash games for some time, so i registered to a freeroll. Played in the tourney for like 40 minutes, no problems with chips (but farly no chiplead either) and then this hand came... (edited chips to $ because Texas Grab'em doesnt accept tournament hands )


      Known players: (for a description of vp$ip, pfr, ats, folded bb, af, wts, wsd or hands click here)     
      UTG+2:
      $15660
      Hero:
      $4720
      MP1:
      $16770

      0/0 No-Limit Hold'em (8 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Texas Grabem 1.9 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K:club: , K:heart:
      MP1 calls $300,00, Hero raises to $1200,00, 5 folds, UTG+2 calls $900,00, MP1 folds.

      Flop: ($2400,00) 4:spade: , J:diamond: , Q:club: (2 players)
      UTG+2 checks, Hero bets $3520, UTG+2 calls $3520,00.

      Turn: ($9440,00) 5:spade:
      River: ($9440,00) 3:heart:


      Final Pot: $9440,00

      Results:
      UTG+2 shows [ 4d, 3s ] two pairs, Fours and Threes
      Hero shows [ Kc, Kh ] a pair of Kings
      UTG+2 wins $9740 USD with two pairs, Fours and Threes.


      What am I doing wrong? :spade:
  • 29 replies
    • redskwerl
      redskwerl
      Black
      Joined: 03.03.2008 Posts: 3,802
      standard variance imo
    • Paznecht
      Paznecht
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.01.2008 Posts: 78
      oh come on...

      Known players: (for a description of vp$ip, pfr, ats, folded bb, af, wts, wsd or hands click here)
      CO:
      $1,81
      MP3:
      $5,36
      MP2:
      $14,79
      Hero:
      $2
      UTG+2:
      $1,70
      UTG+1:
      $11,04
      SB:
      $10
      MP1:
      $3,85
      BU:
      $13,59

      0,05/0,10 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Texas Grabem 1.9 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is BB with K:spade: , A:spade:
      4 folds, MP3 raises to $0,30, CO folds, BU calls $0,30, SB folds, Hero raises to $2,00 (All-In), MP3 calls $1,70, BU folds.

      Flop: ($4,35) 3:club: , 9:spade: , 5:heart:
      Turn: ($4,35) J:heart:
      River: ($4,35) Q:heart:


      Final Pot: $4,35

      Results:
      MP3 shows [ 3s, Ad ] a pair of Threes
      Hero shows [ Ks, As ] high card Ace
      MP3 wins $4.14 USD with a pair of Threes.

      UPDATE:

      2hands back to back at one table and one on a table right next this one


      Known players: (for a description of vp$ip, pfr, ats, folded bb, af, wts, wsd or hands click here)
      MP2:
      $12,20
      CO:
      $10
      Hero:
      $1,90
      MP1:
      $9,22
      BU:
      $4,06
      UTG+2:
      $12,45
      BB:
      $15,20
      MP3:
      $4,04

      0,05/0,10 No-Limit Hold'em (8 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Texas Grabem 1.9 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is SB with A:spade: , A:diamond:
      4 folds, CO raises to $0,40, BU folds, Hero raises to $1,90 (All-In), BB folds, CO calls $1,50.

      Flop: ($3,90) 9:heart: , T:club: , J:club:
      Turn: ($3,90) 3:diamond:
      River: ($3,90) 9:spade:


      Final Pot: $3,90

      Results follow (highlight to see):
      CO shows [ Ah, Jh ] two pairs, Jacks and Nines
      Hero shows [ As, Ad ] two pairs, Aces and Nines
      Hero wins $3.71 USD with two pairs, Aces and Nines.



      Known players: (for a description of vp$ip, pfr, ats, folded bb, af, wts, wsd or hands click here)
      MP1:
      $12,20
      MP3:
      $10
      Hero:
      $3,71
      UTG+2:
      $9,22
      CO:
      $4,06
      BB:
      $12,45
      SB:
      $15,10
      MP2:
      $4,04

      0,05/0,10 No-Limit Hold'em (8 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Texas Grabem 1.9 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is BU with A:diamond: , A:heart:
      UTG+2 calls $0,10, 4 folds, Hero raises to $0,50, 2 folds, UTG+2 raises to $9,22 (All-In), Hero raises to $3,71 (All-In).

      Flop: ($13,08) K:spade: , T:diamond: , 2:spade:
      Turn: ($13,08) Q:club:
      River: ($13,08) 6:club:


      Final Pot: $13,08

      Results follow (highlight to see):
      Hero shows [ Ad, Ah ] a pair of Aces
      UTG+2 shows [ Qs, Qd ] three of a kind, Queens
      UTG+2 wins $5.51 USD with three of a kind, Queens.
      UTG+2 wins $7.20 USD with three of a kind, Queens.



      Known players: (for a description of vp$ip, pfr, ats, folded bb, af, wts, wsd or hands click here)
      SB:
      $1,90
      MP3:
      $11,59
      Hero:
      $1,85
      MP2:
      $9,80
      MP1:
      $1,50
      UTG+2:
      $9,91
      BU:
      $15,78
      BB:
      $10
      CO:
      $2,15

      0,05/0,10 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Texas Grabem 1.9 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with A:heart: , K:spade:
      Hero raises to $0,40, 6 folds, SB raises to $1,90 (All-In), BB folds, Hero raises to $1,85 (All-In).

      Flop: ($3,85) 9:heart: , 9:club: , 7:diamond:
      Turn: ($3,85) A:club:
      River: ($3,85) 3:heart:


      Final Pot: $3,85

      Results follow (highlight to see):
      SB shows [ 9d, 9s ] four of a kind, Nines
      Hero shows [ Ah, Ks ] two pairs, Aces and Nines
      SB wins $0.05 USD with four of a kind, Nines.
      SB wins $3.61 USD with four of a kind, Nines.

      Not just trips, this time quads ...
      o.O
    • Paznecht
      Paznecht
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.01.2008 Posts: 78
      seriously, guys? do aces or king win something? in my last ~1k hands my all-in aces won only a few blinds and the hand noted above and all the money were lost by aces in the next hand so i dont take those first as winning...now i am at -40BB / 100 while playing totaly according to the starting hand chart and other stuff noted in SSS articles. Btw, should even make more money, because i've been catching KK and AA very often recently...

      I just dont understand it...now i am roughly at 100BB, i am surely going to get broke this way when even 90%+ equity (AA vs AKo) isn't enough for me to win with ... don't know what now ... playing SSS, i dont see no other way how to get some BR back, although SSS aint working at all now...
    • ovechkin91
      ovechkin91
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.06.2008 Posts: 201
      play 30K to 40K hands and u will see that aces and king r great.
    • Paznecht
      Paznecht
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.01.2008 Posts: 78
      Originally posted by ovechkin91
      play 30K to 40K hands and u will see that aces and king r great.
      with my 100BB left and -50BB/100 i dont think, that it will last 30k hands :/ (however, surely i know, they're great, but last series of hands did not proved it at all and those back to back aces ... that must have been some kind of sick joke )
    • aciddrop
      aciddrop
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.10.2006 Posts: 1,519
      Yeah, it can certainly feel like a sick joke sometimes. But you need to look at the hands you played. You got the money in best, and you cannot do more than that.

      You won.

      You probably don't believe that, because your bankroll has taken a hit. This is variance, and it is cruel.

      Poker is a great teacher, because if you have any ego invested at all, you will be hurt. If you want to survive, you have to get off the emotional rollercoaster. There is no place for it.

      Take another look at the hands you posted, and work out how much you won on each one. Really understand that you won. Then rest. Then keep making winning plays.
    • Paznecht
      Paznecht
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.01.2008 Posts: 78
      Nevermind, I'm broke :P
    • Dickbreakr
      Dickbreakr
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.08.2008 Posts: 62
      Jesus christ those are some serious badbeats..

      Variance is a serious bitch
    • ovechkin91
      ovechkin91
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.06.2008 Posts: 201
      Originally posted by Paznecht
      Originally posted by ovechkin91
      play 30K to 40K hands and u will see that aces and king r great.
      with my 100BB left and -50BB/100 i dont think, that it will last 30k hands :/ (however, surely i know, they're great, but last series of hands did not proved it at all and those back to back aces ... that must have been some kind of sick joke )
      Downswings suck i just had a 600BB downer myself
    • Paznecht
      Paznecht
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.01.2008 Posts: 78
      Hi guys...after those bad beats, some poker tracker problems and a lot a work to do i almost completely gave up playing for few months (that's why i have bronze status now). Recently i convinced a friend to join PS and as he was playing it was always drawing me to start playing too. So now i began playing again, started some SSS sessions to get some BR back hoping that my swing is somewhere far away. But I have no idea how is that possible, but people still call me with worse hands...far worse hands and they just keep winning. My KK isn't good enough to beat J6o ...
      And the worst thing is, that i can not play ANY cards after doubling up (which doesn't not happen very often) and and waiting for the blinds to come....As you may see in the previous posts with those back to back aces. It's ALWAYS the same. I double up, get AA or KK and lose while being all-in preflop.
      I just don't know ... i cannot play because i have no chance to win at all..
      I know there's also no way you can help me here ... I just had to write this
    • mishkagg
      mishkagg
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.07.2008 Posts: 1,354
      OMG dude, take the beats like a man, play the right limits and don't tilt! But for god's sake, stop bitching for losing $10 or $12. People playing the SSS swing with like 16 BI per session and they also play the right hands... Yes, that is around $160 on the NL50 and it is absolutely and completely possible!

      And what do you expect from the SSS? If you have a win ratio of around 3-4 big blinds pr 100 hands - you should be a happy man, that's the reality of the SSS player.

      Can't you people get it that with the SSS when you go all in you are likely to be called by a good hand and it's usually a 60/40 you vs the villain. You got the money in good, yes. But you lose. And even if it happens 8 times in a row, the chance fro you to win is always 60/40 so if you play enough hands things are bound to change, there's no way cheating the statistics.

      It's getting pathetic to post every KK and AA you lose... I mean - grow some fucking balls! We all lose with them all the time but we sure as hell don't bitch on every bad beat! I lost a full stack with AA vs KTo on a flop of QJA today - crap, what's the world coming to...
    • Paznecht
      Paznecht
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.01.2008 Posts: 78
      mishkagg...if you would have read the whole thread, you would know that I would certainly be a very happy man if i had 3-4bb / 100. Just read the topic and find the actual value.

      If I were losing in 60/40 situations then no problem, but I'm losing 90%+ for me situations. And i don't farely post every AA, KK that I lost, not every bad beat. the hands posted here were just a small portion.

      You know what, just let it be, think that you're the man, THE ONE who has the balls and who knows everything... just try to read the thread next time you post something and avoid posting anything else here...thanks
    • sm112
      sm112
      Black
      Joined: 14.10.2008 Posts: 213
      Bad beats lead to tilt, tilt leads to -EV play. Usually what seems to be a downswing is actually bad play triggered by some bad beats. That doesn't mean downswings don't exist, of course they do, but they wouldn't be so serious if we always play according to optimal strategy. I have had a session of 1000 hands and 15 buy-ins down, but I also have had sessions of 10+ buy-ins up. I had 30k hands break-even stretch last month and started this month with 15k hands break-even, but I'm still +2bb/100 from the beginning of my NL100 SSS experience. It's not the downswings that keep this winrate low, it's my not being able to handle the tilt. There's no point posting the hands you were a favourite in. Better post hands you weren't and try to find your leaks.
    • JuiceQuadre
      JuiceQuadre
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.10.2008 Posts: 2,688
      Well i dont think making those threads is bad.. I mad one myself just to heal my attitude =) We all know sometimes it can be hard..
      Ofc ppl lose so much more money than we , who are just at the beggining, but at the beggining its not easy, because we havent experienced many downswings so far and i think posting thread about being angry and about being scared of going broke etc makes sense, since this is just awesome community and there is always someone who is gonna say: "hey man dont give up! Its just standart variance you gonna beat it, just try to learn more and dont stop trying ;) " And thats something that helps alot, it gives you strenght when you r down =) so why not..
    • mishkagg
      mishkagg
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.07.2008 Posts: 1,354
      Originally posted by Paznecht
      mishkagg...if you would have read the whole thread, you would know that I would certainly be a very happy man if i had 3-4bb / 100. Just read the topic and find the actual value.

      If I were losing in 60/40 situations then no problem, but I'm losing 90%+ for me situations. And i don't farely post every AA, KK that I lost, not every bad beat. the hands posted here were just a small portion.

      You know what, just let it be, think that you're the man, THE ONE who has the balls and who knows everything... just try to read the thread next time you post something and avoid posting anything else here...thanks
      Yes, I took the time to read everything.
      This lead to my response - all I saw was the whining of a dude who can't handle bad beats in a game which is BOUND to give him bad beats. In fact you want players that are going to call your raise in 90/10 situations. It doesn't matter if you win or lose this current hand. It doesn't matter if the same shit's going to happen 7 more times in a row. What matters here is that you made the correct decision so you are on the road to profit already. Just stick to the game plan.

      But if it makes you happy to bitch here about bad beats instead of just accepting them - I am perfectly fine with that.

      I am sorry if I offended you in some way.

      I guess my point is this: stick to the game plan and play your A game regardless of results. Whining about failures is pointless and won't get you further in your development as a player or in life. :f_cool:
    • alejandrosh
      alejandrosh
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.07.2008 Posts: 4,346
      all you can really hope for playing poker is making +ev desitions a decent amount of the time. hopefully enough time to be a winning player over a big sample size.

      you can't control the cards to come, can you?
    • Tim64
      Tim64
      Black
      Joined: 02.11.2008 Posts: 7,401
      It's getting pathetic to post every KK and AA you lose... I mean - grow some fucking balls! We all lose with them all the time but we sure as hell don't bitch on every bad beat! I lost a full stack with AA vs KTo on a flop of QJA today - crap, what's the world coming to...

      I guess my point is this: stick to the game plan and play your A game regardless of results. Whining about failures is pointless and won't get you further in your development as a player or in life.


      The difficulty is that a begginer player doesn't know whether they are playing their A game - they don't yet have the experience. They also don't have the experience to know how much downswings are a part of the game and how long d/swings can go on for.

      What is needed is to reassure the poster that he did the right thing in the hands he posted (p.s. OP; better to post these on the SSS hands forum ;) ) and that what he is going through is actually quite normal - even if it seems like the cards aren't favouring him. What is less helpful is telling him to grow some ****** ****. Encouragment, not criticism, is how you help people to improve.
    • Jackalof
      Jackalof
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.06.2008 Posts: 1,462
      Encouragment, not criticism, is how you help people to improve.

      Good job, Uwe Boll, keep up the good work :f_biggrin:
    • mishkagg
      mishkagg
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.07.2008 Posts: 1,354
      Originally posted by Tim64
      The difficulty is that a begginer player doesn't know whether they are playing their A game - they don't yet have the experience. They also don't have the experience to know how much downswings are a part of the game and how long d/swings can go on for.

      What is needed is to reassure the poster that he did the right thing in the hands he posted (p.s. OP; better to post these on the SSS hands forum ;) ) and that what he is going through is actually quite normal - even if it seems like the cards aren't favouring him. What is less helpful is telling him to grow some ****** ****. Encouragment, not criticism, is how you help people to improve.
      Hello!
      Yeah, I agree completely except for the part where he doesn't know what's an A game.

      Here's why: He is posting hands where he loses with AA and KK while playing the SSS. And his goal is to go all in with them, pre-flop if possible. That't the A-game with the SSS. Everyone who read the first article/watched the first video should understand that. It's quite simple: go all in with AA and KK. Even if the shit happens and you lose 7 times in a row - try to go all in with AA and KK pre-flop if possible.

      And also - some criticism never hurt me. :f_cool:
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