Adjusting ICM?

    • Smileyphil
      Smileyphil
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.10.2008 Posts: 488
      On several of the posts here I have noticed players saying that they either exploit ICM players by pushing looser? Or that they adjust their push ranges based on other players?

      I have only been using ICM for a short while and am wondering how much effect this has. Isn't ICM supposed to be an almost optimal strategy and is it really worth altering the ranges? Can players really exploit someone doing ICM?

      Since I'm relatively new to ICM pushing/folding I guess I should stick as rigidly as I can using ICM trainer?

      p.s. I like the feeling of joy when my 67s or 33 get busted by Aces but I still know I did the right thing. Its so much better than cash games where you wish you'd hidden away and folded like everyone else.
  • 5 replies
    • gavinonymous
      gavinonymous
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2008 Posts: 1,146
      My thoughts on this:

      If I'm in BB and the ICM playing SB raises me - I know he's going to push any two cards. I adjust my calling range. It's straight ICM, and really we should have even results against each other in the long run.

      I also know that ICM players are tighter calling my push from UTG than from BTN, so I might make a more marginal push UTG if these players are in the blinds and I need to steal before the blinds come around again. Basically I try to put myself in their position and see what their ICM range should be and what I would do in their spot before I act.

      I think ICM by definition is the optimal way to play, but you can also give up some +$EV pushes and make some -$EV calls sometimes if the situation is right.

      An example might be leaving a push from the BTN to let the SB push his ATC over the BB. You gain $EV by folding especially the other two get into it and one busts out.
    • miskokvo
      miskokvo
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.03.2008 Posts: 1,502
      icm depends of calling/open ranges of yours opponents ... download sng wiz or watch vids and you will learn how
    • bkbart
      bkbart
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.04.2007 Posts: 327
      if you have info to put players on a range that is not normal you must adjust your play against them.
    • Lunkan
      Lunkan
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.05.2008 Posts: 84
      The ICM-chart you are given in the articles suggests an average calling range applied for everyone, however in reality everyone won't call with the same cards. Some people like calling with TT+, some with Ax. If you know the individual calling range of each player, you can adjust your ICM-strategy further. As said before, download SNG wiz and you will learn how it works!
      Let's hope that dang Elephant will be able to do that in the future :)
    • Barbarendave
      Barbarendave
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.11.2007 Posts: 822
      Originally posted by gavinonymous
      My thoughts on this:

      If I'm in BB and the ICM playing SB raises me - I know he's going to push any two cards. I adjust my calling range. It's straight ICM, and really we should have even results against each other in the long run.

      I also know that ICM players are tighter calling my push from UTG than from BTN, so I might make a more marginal push UTG if these players are in the blinds and I need to steal before the blinds come around again. Basically I try to put myself in their position and see what their ICM range should be and what I would do in their spot before I act.

      I think ICM by definition is the optimal way to play, but you can also give up some +$EV pushes and make some -$EV calls sometimes if the situation is right.

      An example might be leaving a push from the BTN to let the SB push his ATC over the BB. You gain $EV by folding especially the other two get into it and one busts out.
      Please don´t make the mistake to loose-up calling ranges to much. If you are in a bubblesituation in a SNG and you as BB and the SB have both medium or big stacks, you can´t call his SB-push loose, just because he push any2. Even if you are sure, he pushes any 2, you still can just call him with around top 10-13% of your hands, because otherwise you both would make loss, while the other stacks automatically make profit by just watching. Many people make the mistake, to think any2 stands for a bad hand, in fact AA and KK are also any2. So, if you adept, adept rather your pushing than your callingrange, because the worst ICM-mistakes are made by bad calls.

      Sry for my english, I´m german, I hope you understand what I mean