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[NL10] KK vs raise OTF

    • ferdhy5
      Joined: 21.04.2014 Posts: 50
      888 Poker - $0.10 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 4 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

      BTN: 120.4 BB (VPIP: 23.08, PFR: 18.99, 3Bet Preflop: 7.64, Hands: 438)
      Hero (SB): 140.1 BB
      BB: 156.9 BB (VPIP: 26.73, PFR: 14.85, 3Bet Preflop: 5.56, Hands: 107)
      CO: 102.1 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 18.75, 3Bet Preflop: 7.89, Hands: 104)

      Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

      Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K:diamond: K:spade:

      fold, BTN raises to 2 BB, Hero raises to 6 BB, fold, BTN calls 4 BB

      Flop: (13 BB, 2 players) T:heart: 4:diamond: Q:heart:
      Hero bets 7.5 BB, BTN raises to 23 BB, Hero calls 15.5 BB

      Turn: (59 BB, 2 players) 9:diamond:
      Hero checks, BTN bets 43.2 BB, fold,

      Does it make any sense calling villains raise OOP and see what he does OTT? There are many scary cards that might come up OOT. So if I'm not folding maybe I should better shove after the raise. What do you think guys?
  • 7 replies
    • RubbyDubby
      Joined: 15.02.2018 Posts: 193
      Hi ferdhy5
      I play 2NL but nobody replied so far so maybe my two cents are welcome.

      I would jam the flop. Makes life easy. Sets are rare and AA? Would'nt he 4bet preflop?
    • VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 10,838
      This smells like a combo draw if so, this is a coinflip.

      Board: T:heart: 4:diamond: Q:heart:
             Equity     Win     Tie
      BU     50.92%  50.65%   0.27% { AhKh, AhJh, KhJh, Jh9h, 9h8h }
      SB     49.08%  48.81%   0.27% { KdKs }

      If we throw some AQ and AhTh into the mix (possible, but not likely) then you're ahead:

      Board: T:heart: 4:diamond: Q:heart:  9:diamond:
             Equity     Win     Tie
      BU     22.79%  22.59%   0.20% { AQs, AhKh, AhJh, KhJh, AhTh, Jh9h, 9h8h, AQo }
      SB     77.21%  77.01%   0.20% { KdKs }

      Turn aggression wins pots, esp if the opponent is passive. It isn't necessary to jam the flop -- you're both fairly deep.
      Re-raising the flop to 60BB shows you mean business.

      Just out of curiosity, when you flat call his flop raise, what is your plan for the rest of the hand?
      Any heart, any card that completes the straight -- even a K is really bad for your hand.

      At first I didn't like RubbyDubby's suggestion of jamming, but the more I look at this hand, the more I like it.

      I'm curious to see what others think,
    • nitrol
      Joined: 24.07.2010 Posts: 12,022
      I do not like jamming. There are too many combos of 2p+ hands than combos of combo draws...
    • mbml
      Joined: 27.11.2008 Posts: 20,779
      No chance in hell im folding here. He could have AQ, which means that you should never fold any made hand above AQ in absolute strength. Not to mention that he'll often have AJ which will double barrel, as well as some random backdoor flush draw. I think check/jam is best for hands that are difficult to play on rivers, and check/call is good if you have some sort of hand which contains a made hand with a draw or blocker (QJ and KK with diamonds/hearts are much better calls compared to AcAs which should always be check/jammed)
    • CucumbaMan
      Joined: 13.10.2017 Posts: 243
      Well actually I kinda like the idea of jamming the flop, in similar situations I've seen a lot of top pair-top kicker with the A of hearts, so I think jamming with an overpair is fine. If Villain has a draw or combo draw then he should pay the price.
    • RubbyDubby
      Joined: 15.02.2018 Posts: 193
      Originally posted by nitrol
      I do not like jamming. There are too many combos of 2p+ hands than combos of combo draws...
      If you do not jam you have to fold but that is way to nitty for me!

      mbml's suggestion is a bit to advanced for my 2NL level. I jam hands that will be difficult to play on turns.
    • ferdhy5
      Joined: 21.04.2014 Posts: 50
      Thanks for your feedback!
      Folding on the flop seemed too nitty to me, but I wasn't sure about jamming. That's why I opted for calling, altough it's true that many turn cards would be scary. So now I'm more inclined towards shoving OTF.
      Furthermore, this guy had a rather high postflop AF=4. Is that something that would affect you decision guys?