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Flushes...WHYWHYWHY???

    • OlloG
      OlloG
      Basic
      Joined: 17.05.2018 Posts: 4
      Hello, I am a newby to NL Holdem. I've been playing at various sights (not real money) and I'm having a blast! I really enjoy playing! And I think I'm doing pretty well considering my greenhorn status. I frequently make it to the final 10% of players of tournies from 50 to 800 players and I've even won a few.
      Question: Why does my power hand keep losing my stack to flushes!! What do I do?? I have to bet...I have the power, then they complete a flush with the river AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!
  • 8 replies
    • Lazza61
      Lazza61
      Headadmin
      Headadmin
      Joined: 23.03.2011 Posts: 10,741
      Hey OlloG,

      Welcome to PokerStrategy.com :welcome:

      Unfortunately, that is poker. But the good news is that your power hands will be profitable over time. Also, when you are not playing for money, people will play all sorts of garbage hands.

      This will also happen at the micro/low limits of real money poker as well. The secret is to look through the betting action on previous streets to see if you can put your opponent on a hand range that includes draws.

      With experience, you will find some spots where it will be fairly obvious that you should fold rather than commit.

      If you have any questions for us, then please don't hesitate to ask. We are a friendly and helpful community, so ask those questions and you will likely get good advice.

      Have fun :gl:

      Laz
    • OlloG
      OlloG
      Basic
      Joined: 17.05.2018 Posts: 4
      Oh, man it just happened again! 2 flushes in a row!! Okay, when I played stud and draw poker, a flush was a DIFFICULT hand to get. They did not come very often. Since I've been playing holdem online, I see them a lot! So you're saying its because its just funnymoney and players do wacky things they wouldn't do in real life?

      Also, I see players calling pre-flop with almost any suited cards in pocket. Is that smart? Like calling with a 2d 9d - that's playing for the flush pre-flop and it seems insane to me. Am I wrong?
    • Lazza61
      Lazza61
      Headadmin
      Headadmin
      Joined: 23.03.2011 Posts: 10,741
      Hey OlloG,

      Yes and no. People will play wacky hands and they will overplay wacky hands as well. But there is also variance in poker which ultimately is why good players eventually come out on top.

      Sadly variance can burn you over short periods. i.e. people always seem to hit their 25% river to complete their flush, or your power hands never improve and get run down by fish who improve on every street. Conversely, you will have runs where your power hands always hold and fish never hit their flushes.

      Two important things to remember:

      Don't be focussed on short term results and events. Poker is played for the long haul. It could take 10s or even 100s of thousands hands for variance to even out.

      Secondly, you must not allow bad beats/suckouts/coolers affect your mindset. I have seen good players (and me as well) completely unravel. For me, I had to literally forget everything I had ever learned and rebuild my game from the ground up.

      I am now totally unaffected by bad beats/suckouts/coolers. I know now that as long as I keep the right mindset, then I will play my A-game more often and this will ensure that I m a profitable player.

      Flushes are also more prevalent in games where you have community cards like NLHE or PLO.

      I recommend that you check out these videos by Mindset coach SteffenRachut:

      How to Mentally Adapt to Today's Poker
      Tilt Free Masterclas - Module 1 - What Is Tilt?

      Regards

      Laz
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 10,742
      Originally posted by OlloG
      Also, I see players calling pre-flop with almost any suited cards in pocket. Is that smart? Like calling with a 2d 9d - that's playing for the flush pre-flop and it seems insane to me. Am I wrong?
      It is insane, and you're not wrong.

      When you played draw poker and stud, did you play for real money?
      If so, I'm sure you'll agree that people tend to hang on to their real money a lot tighter than they hang on to their play chips.

      However, even with real money you will find players that play flush draws a lot.
      The reason is simple: When they hit, they can get stacks:

      Consider this hand:
      Hero: A:A:
      Villain: :9s: :8s:

      Equilab shows this:

             Equity     Win     Tie
      MP2    77.38%  77.22%   0.15% { AdAh }
      MP3    22.62%  22.47%   0.15% { 9s8s }


      Woohoo!
      Now the flop is: :Kh: :7s: :6s:

      Care to guess who has the edge now?

      According to Equilab:

      Board: 6:spade: 7:spade: K:club:
             Equity     Win     Tie
      MP2    43.74%  43.74%   0.00% { AdAh }
      MP3    56.26%  56.26%   0.00% { 9s8s }

      the suited connectors have a slight edge.

      Equilab is a great tool for analysing hands -- at it's free (at least the linked version is)
      https://www.pokerstrategy.com/poker-software-tools/equilab-holdem/

      There are a lot more tools at https://www.pokerstrategy.com/poker-software-tools/

      Best of luck,
      VS
    • OlloG
      OlloG
      Basic
      Joined: 17.05.2018 Posts: 4
      Thanks for the info! I'm now convinced that the variability that you speak of is MUCH more an issue on these sites simply because its not real money. I've watched many players (myself included) do things they would NEVER do if it was real. But, I think there is a way to play those players, and to also just accept it as part of that kind of play.
    • SDK1987
      SDK1987
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 12.11.2008 Posts: 37,810
      It’s less likely, but at the real money games enough players that makes dumb moves.

      Cheers,
      SDK1987
    • OlloG
      OlloG
      Basic
      Joined: 17.05.2018 Posts: 4
      Really? Because I would be real careful with real money. I see so many of these suck out flushes & straights. However, my thinking is this: to prevent those from coming, I have to figure out when and how to raise BIG to scare that hand away early. I just starting experimenting with raises against the suck out, sometimes they run and sometimes they double down on me.
    • Lazza61
      Lazza61
      Headadmin
      Headadmin
      Joined: 23.03.2011 Posts: 10,741
      Hey OlloG,

      Originally posted by OlloG
      Really? Because I would be real careful with real money. I see so many of these suck out flushes & straights. However, my thinking is this: to prevent those from coming, I have to figure out when and how to raise BIG to scare that hand away early. I just starting experimenting with raises against the suck out, sometimes they run and sometimes they double down on me.
      This exactly, as well as betting bigger to ensure that they don't have the correct pot odds to call profitably long term.

      Check out No-Limit Beginner's Course with confidant91 [2017 edition]. You will find a lot of good info there.

      Cheers :f_drink:

      Laz