This site uses cookies to improve your browsing experience. By continuing to browse the website, you accept such cookies. For more details and to change your settings, see our Cookie Policy and Privacy Policy. Close

[NL2] OP vs 3bet

    • Paaaaaaaaaulo
      Paaaaaaaaaulo
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.06.2010 Posts: 694
      PokerStars - €0.02 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

      BTN: 124 BB (VPIP: 41.67, PFR: 16.67, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
      SB: 109.5 BB (VPIP: 15.38, PFR: 12.82, 3Bet Preflop: 5.00, Hands: 40)
      BB: 100 BB (VPIP: 10.53, PFR: 5.26, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 20)
      UTG: 116 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 33.33, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 4)
      Hero (MP): 123.5 BB
      CO: 220 BB (VPIP: 24.39, PFR: 19.51, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 41)

      SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

      Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has T:club: T:diamond:

      fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, CO raises to 9 BB, fold, fold, fold, Hero calls 6 BB

      Flop: (19.5 BB, 2 players) 6:club: 2:spade: 7:heart:
      Hero checks, CO bets 14.5 BB, Hero calls 14.5 BB

      Turn: (48.5 BB, 2 players) 5:diamond:
      Hero checks, CO bets 36 BB, fold

      CO wins 46 BB
  • 11 replies
    • zetozinho
      zetozinho
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.06.2017 Posts: 295
      This 3bet pots with 2 barrels always makes me think that their range is a big overpair.
      The turn is fold or raise, a call OOP is not good imo.
      If you raise and he 3bets, you know where you stand. If he calls and river doesnt help, you also have a easier decision.
      Folding is acceptable as well imo.
    • MyFloXyBabY
      MyFloXyBabY
      Platinum
      Joined: 15.02.2010 Posts: 3,221
      Nh.

      Raising turn to "know where you stand" would be awful, as it nearly always is at poker. Villain is representing so strong with his stupidly big sizings and all. I'd even overfold a little versus that so turning a "normal" fold into a bluffraise is simply out of question.
    • RemiRem
      RemiRem
      Silver
      Joined: 27.12.2009 Posts: 73
      Calling 3bets OOP is not good idea in general. Post flop will be torture, we are not playing micros because we are good postflop :D Here you hit a perfect flop, but still not so easy to make overcards to fold, and probably you are vs. JJ-AA. I havent checked on Pokertracker for profitablity yet, but my line with 88-JJ OOP is 4bet as a bluff and fold to shove.
    • MyFloXyBabY
      MyFloXyBabY
      Platinum
      Joined: 15.02.2010 Posts: 3,221
      Originally posted by RemiRem
      Calling 3bets OOP is not good idea in general. Post flop will be torture, we are not playing micros because we are good postflop :D
      Micros or not, you have to call 3bet OOP at this game, so you might as well try to be good at it.
      And you become good postflop neither by magically climbing up in stakes nor by avoiding playing postflop, but by playing postflop even OOP even in 3bet pots.


      Originally posted by RemiRem
      Here you hit a perfect flop, but still not so easy to make overcards to fold, and probably you are vs. JJ-AA.
      I don't see what that flop has that is so perfect about it. Far from it actually. I agree that villain has often a big OP though and that's part of what makes that flop so not favorable for us.



      Originally posted by RemiRem
      I havent checked on Pokertracker for profitablity yet, but my line with 88-JJ OOP is 4bet as a bluff and fold to shove.
      I don't like it at all and have never heard of someone doing that before. Those are among the best hands to call with, don't turn them into mediocre bluffs !
      To bluff versus an IP 3better you need something more playable and more blocking such as KQo or A5s, sometimes AJo or AQo depending on the spot and the villain.
    • la55i
      la55i
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 27.01.2013 Posts: 8,491
      Standard call pre. OTF I would call once. OTT starts to concern me more and I think we can fold.

      Agree with floxy that raising OTT would be bad. Also wouldn't 4bet pre.
    • MyFloXyBabY
      MyFloXyBabY
      Platinum
      Joined: 15.02.2010 Posts: 3,221
      Originally posted by la55i
      Agree with floxy
      Be careful dude. You might become my brainless dog :P
      And then you won't be able to compute the infinite level. Shame.
    • la55i
      la55i
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 27.01.2013 Posts: 8,491
      :mdr:
    • sdf256
      sdf256
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.07.2016 Posts: 199
      Totally agree with Floxy too. Hand is well played.
    • RemiRem
      RemiRem
      Silver
      Joined: 27.12.2009 Posts: 73
      Originally posted by MyFloXyBabY

      Micros or not, you have to call 3bet OOP at this game, so you might as well try to be good at it.
      And you become good postflop neither by magically climbing up in stakes nor by avoiding playing postflop, but by playing postflop even OOP even in 3bet pots.



      I don't see what that flop has that is so perfect about it. Far from it actually. I agree that villain has often a big OP though and that's part of what makes that flop so not favorable for us.


      I don't like it at all and have never heard of someone doing that before. Those are among the best hands to call with, don't turn them into mediocre bluffs !
      To bluff versus an IP 3better you need something more playable and more blocking such as KQo or A5s, sometimes AJo or AQo depending on the spot and the villain.

      Thanks for criticism, I really do have a bad mindset. Usually way too agro preflop, lots of mistakes postfop. Plan is to grind 100k hands on NL5 and get coaching at NL10. Any other approach suggestions?
    • MyFloXyBabY
      MyFloXyBabY
      Platinum
      Joined: 15.02.2010 Posts: 3,221
      More than playing (which helps nevertheless), you need to work outside the tables to know better where you stand. Design ranges, put a flop on equilab or flopzilla or whatever soft you're using and see what you bet/call/fold/raise and where does it lead you on different runouts.

      It's hard, sweaty, unsexy work. But it's where it's at. What all great players do or have been doing. What Matthew Janda is showing on his YT videos, or even Doug Polk in his "How to improve at poker right now" video. There's also a good serie on 3bet pot by w34z3l etc..
    • zetozinho
      zetozinho
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.06.2017 Posts: 295
      You can't just raise and fold to every 3bet they put over you. But you need to be selective about the hands you choose to play in this spots. TT is more than good to play it, even OOP. You can't just fold TT to 3bets. Only if you know he is a complete nit, and even in that case I don't know.
      On NL2 just stick to the basic. Call pre, call flop, check-fold OTT. There's nothing wrong with it. There's no need to fight in marginal spots and make extremely difficult decisions. There's so much money to be made on easier situations.