# ICM: 3% calling range enough for a fold?

• Bronze
Joined: 07.05.2008
Now this is a situation in SnGWiz that I stumbled across while doing a quiz.

What I want to know is, how is this a fold when the BB is calling super-nitty?

Compared to this situation, which really isn't much different, it's a shove..

Is that 2.8% enough to justify a fold?
• 6 replies
• Bronze
Joined: 15.10.2008
Originally posted by midgetjay
Is that 2.8% enough to justify a fold?
It is not only 2.8%. It is 2x more players behind you.
• Bronze
Joined: 19.04.2008
1st hand icm tax is super-heavy with the shortstack on BU. If BB calls you are almost always facked, while you have a lot of equity now.

I suggest a call in first hand, although push looks good aswell tbh.
• Bronze
Joined: 28.03.2008

scenario 1:
your equity is for example 25% with stack of 1202
pushing player equity is 5% ... 367
Big blind equity is 20% ... 982

why you need randge of 88+?
-because if Big Bling wake up with a monster ... you lost 20% of equity and you are pretty fuked up

**my play when i was BB(you are isolating small stack so you range is like A8+ KQ+ 55+ ... so if i had read on you i probably call with AJs+ definetly not folding JJ+ maybe TT+ ) coz easily shorty can have ace,you can have ace ... sou im favaorite but that is my by the way thinking**

scenario 2:
pushing player equity 5%

even if you loose you have still 20% euqity no metter what so you can call looser

(matematicly ((% eq is randomize))
sc 1:
prize pool 63\$...
Hero..(eq 25%) = 15,75\$
Pusher(eq 5%) = 3,15\$
BB (eq 20%) = 12,6\$

you can win,loose

if you win when you call pusher you gain only 3,15\$ so your eq will be 18,75\$
if you loose against BB with range of JJ+ AQs+ 15,75-12,6= so your eq will be 3\$

sc 2:
prize pool..
Hero....
Pusher......

if you win your equity will be 18,75\$
even if you loose your equity will be not lower than 12\$??

see diferences????

in worse case in sc 1: you will have only 3\$
sc 2: you will have still 12\$ even if you loose
• Bronze
Joined: 07.05.2008
Originally posted by ChoChikun
Originally posted by midgetjay
Is that 2.8% enough to justify a fold?
It is not only 2.8%. It is 2x more players behind you.
I only see one person?

Originally posted by viewer88
1st hand icm tax is super-heavy with the shortstack on BU
I don't understand what you mean by icm tax. Could you explain that to me?

Originally posted by miskokvo
if Big Bling wake up with a monster ... you lost 20% of equity and you are pretty fuked up
But this is only 2.8% of the time. Roughly 1 out of every 36 shoves he will call. Even so, being an 80/20 or 90/10 underdog against him, I can still suckout. I guess I don't see how big of a role the BB plays.

And yes, I do see the differences between the two scenarios, but the worst case possible for the first scenario will only happen rarely. So as I was saying earlier, is that rare occasion of the BB calling me (and his hand holds up) the reason why this is a fold here? Surely it's not the BU or the CO causing it, because in scenario two, it's an easy call with KQs.
• Bronze
Joined: 28.03.2008
even so...

Button has 1BB

why are you risking 90% of your stack when next hand you will be probably ITM?

this is why sng wiz giving you those result coz he is calculating that you will be probably ITM...

next hand you have 20%equity of prize money for sure.... your call doesnt make sense coz if shortstack double up we have 3 big stacks ... with cruss your final chance to win sng...

he will have like 900chips

but this is just fishy move ... he will definitly shove only top hands like JJ+ AQ+ with you are dominated... coz he will not risk 4 BB when sombody on table has 1BB
• Bronze
Joined: 28.03.2008
i dont know ... but i think 10,5% pushing range is little to loose IMO in this spot