[NL20-NL50] 33 MP2 - Quads

    • TheBrood
      TheBrood
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.07.2008 Posts: 4,382
      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      UTG:
      $5.67
      UTG2:
      $20.00
      Hero:
      $20.00
      MP3:
      $20.08

      0.1/0.2 No-Limit Hold'em (10 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy Elephant 0.67 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is MP2 with 3:heart: , 3:diamond:
      UTG calls $0.20, UTG1 folds, UTG2 calls $0.20, MP1 folds, Hero calls $0.20, MP3 raises to $1.40, 5 folds, UTG2 calls $1.20, Hero calls $1.20.

      Flop: ($4.70) 7:heart: , T:heart: , 3:spade: (3 players)
      UTG2 checks, Hero checks, MP3 bets $3.00, UTG2 folds, Hero calls $3.00.

      Turn: ($10.70) 3:club: (2 players)
      Hero checks, MP3 checks.

      River: ($10.70) 4:club: (2 players)
      Hero bets $6.00, MP3 folds.

      Final Pot: $16.70

      Bet on turn to get call from FD right? I was representing FD =S
  • 7 replies
    • Jaissica
      Jaissica
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.02.2009 Posts: 1,385
      Doubt you could have got any more money from this given villain folded on that river, however had villain held an overpair you lost value by not raising the flop. Once you decide to slowplay by calling the flop you cannot out and donk the turn or you essentially say "the turn card helped me" or (more likely on what the villain would consider a blank) "im a really bad slowplayer who tries the call-donk slowplay".

      You were never going to get all-in playing that weak line... OOP check-raise here. If the flop was Q+ high you could donk-raise as its more likely PRF villain will have a made hand.

      Very ordinary flop for a cbet anyway. I wouldnt cbet vs solid player such as you Brood here as I expect you mostly cold-call with PP anyway, much less limp-call line says "I have a PP" and I think you wont believe that I have hit yet, so I think you will call or even raise my cbet even if you dont have a set.

      So as villain here I am check-folding the flop with whatever the villain had (AJ+ looks). Even with an overpair JJ+ I would bet-call flop then fold turn vs solid players. Your limp-call line preflop says PP and any aggression post flop says set.

      Fold preflop and call from IP instead :)
    • Michailewic
      Michailewic
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.04.2008 Posts: 1,418
      You must raise on the flop to protect your hand. Then you can check the turn, since you do not have to protect, pot is big enough to shove the river and we are happy to give villain a free card which "may" help him.

      As played, I would definitelly bet the turn to built a pot.
    • Jaissica
      Jaissica
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.02.2009 Posts: 1,385
      The villain already protected for you, and the third wheel in the hand already folded. Protection is irrelevant to the decision as if villain holds AhKh they already overpaid for their draw with the cbet. You dont give anything "correct odds to draw" by just calling here, so long as you 1. dont intend to over-call to redraw to a FH if the turn is a heart and 2. dont give a free card on the turn.

      The raise here is for value. Either the villain holds a hand that can pay us or they dont. Raise and find out.

      Protection is important but over-used as a reason to raise often in these threads. You arnt protecting from AhKh here, you are simply turning what was already a mistake (semi bluff with outs vs trips, which will never fold to a semi bluff) into an even bigger mistake (making them pay a second time for one card, making their odds even worse).

      Its a value raise, nothing more, nothing less.
    • TheBrood
      TheBrood
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.07.2008 Posts: 4,382
      I dont like raising flop because a c/r represents too much strength. So I let him try and catch an A, K or Q on turn.
      @Jaissica: Being ip would have helped tons in this hand, but I cant fold to 2 full-stacked villains pf. I do see why I could fold vs one though.

      I didnt bet turn because I was oop, and Ive seen these regulars overplay OP a lot. I was expecting a 2barrel from 3.1 AF but his check behind indicates he doesnt have a hand yet.

      Maybe I should have bet the turn, to a reg it could look like a bluff with the paired board and might call with a hand. But I dont see OC continuing to the classic call flop, donk turn line which imo indicates a strong hand.

      I don't think I played it too bad, he just didnt have a hand imo.
    • Michailewic
      Michailewic
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.04.2008 Posts: 1,418
      Originally posted by TheBrood
      I dont like raising flop because a c/r represents too much strength. So I let him try and catch an A, K or Q on turn.
      @Jaissica: Being ip would have helped tons in this hand, but I cant fold to 2 full-stacked villains pf. I do see why I could fold vs one though.
      c/r may also represent a draw. I c/r and go broke. You will often be against flush draw, TPTK, two pair.

      Originally posted by TheBrood
      I didnt bet turn because I was oop, and Ive seen these regulars overplay OP a lot. I was expecting a 2barrel from 3.1 AF but his check behind indicates he doesnt have a hand yet.
      If he has TPTK, he will at least call your bet. By checking, you are offering him to check behind with flush draw (which would fold if unimproved but might call your bet on the turn) or other hands. You want to build a pot (after you missed your opportunity on the flop).
    • caltabiano
      caltabiano
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.03.2007 Posts: 1,992
      I just try to stick my money in on the flop with a c/r and hope he will call with an OP or a draw.

      If he has a draw, now is the time to get value from him. He's much more likely to fold a draw on the turn than folding it on the flop. And he might be inclined to go broke with something like FD + 2 OC. If he has an overpair, he also might be willing to go broke.
      If the flush hits however, he might fold his overpairs and continue with made flushes and that's clearly bad for us
    • Talic
      Talic
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.01.2008 Posts: 1,851
      I agree, c/r flop

      you can bet funky 1/4 of pot on turn or check it and bet 2/3 on river