[NL20-NL50] A8o BU Confusion

    • Verre
      Verre
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.02.2009 Posts: 708
      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      SB:
      $21.62
      BB:
      $6.15
      Hero:
      $19.60

      0.1/0.2 No-Limit Hold'em (10 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy Elephant 0.67 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is BU with A:spade: , 8:diamond:
      7 folds, Hero raises to $0.60, SB calls $0.50, BB calls $0.40.

      Flop: ($1.80) 3:club: , 7:club: , 6:heart: (3 players)
      SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks.

      Turn: ($1.80) A:diamond: (3 players)
      SB checks, BB bets $0.60, Hero calls $0.60, SB calls $0.60.

      River: ($3.60) T:diamond: (3 players)
      SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $2.00, SB folds, BB calls $2.00.

      Final Pot: $7.60

      This hand is confusing. I was ready to give it up after the flop but then I got some turn love.
  • 9 replies
    • Jaissica
      Jaissica
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.02.2009 Posts: 1,385
      Preflop - standard advised raise is 4BB. 60c gives the BB especially good odds to call with rubbishy hands.

      Flop is fine, its hardly a great cbet flop even for IP.

      Turn - As you said, some turn love. We still arnt in a really great situation however we should define our hand here. Raise it up to about $2.40 to push out drawers or crappy pairs. Bet-fold line as we dont often expect to be raised here except by aces-up (A3 A7 A6) or really bad slowplayers (slowplaying on very wet flop).

      On the river as played why call a small bet on the turn then escalate to a larger bet with our marignal top pair on the river? Check behind as played, not many worse hands can call, but plenty of better ones might.
    • Verre
      Verre
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.02.2009 Posts: 708
      Standard advised raise is 3 BB +1 for every limper.
    • sliggy
      sliggy
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.10.2008 Posts: 196
      No it's 4 on PokerStrategy.com, but 3 or 4 is fine. It doesn't matter, just whatever you prefer.

      Played it fine imo.

      Not cbetting the flop was smart as it does well with their calling range and you're not likely to get many folds.

      The turn call was good because nothing worse calls a reraise in a multiway and you can get value from a 2nd bluff on the river.

      The river valuebet was great because no draws completed and everybody on "pot control" lines will pay you off.

      Nicely played, I'd have played it the exact same way.
    • Verre
      Verre
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.02.2009 Posts: 708
      I'll appologize to Jaiss as I was near positive it was 3BB.

      I just checked back and its 4. I have read and reread those posts 3-4 times and for some reason I never picked that one fact up. Its probubly because in live I make 3BB raises.

      I am not sure how much value I have actually lost from this, probubly nothing at all since 3 or 4 seem to be standard and I have read in many books 3 is standard, but the fact that you do give blinds better odds to call is something to take into consideration.

      The reason this post was called "Confusion" is because BB turned AK and I was left shaking my head. I will play this hand this way 100% of the time and I feel I did nothing wrong other than possibly making 2/3 instead of 1/2 bet on the turn.
    • sliggy
      sliggy
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.10.2008 Posts: 196
      I'm assuming you mean bet on the river, not bet on the turn :) . Your bet size was fine. How often do you run into AK here? Not very often at all. You're going to run into a ten or a random pocket pair WAY more often. Hand was played perfectly imo.
    • Verre
      Verre
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.02.2009 Posts: 708
      Yeah my main reason for posting this was because everyone likes a good "WTF kind of line is that" moment when the guy slow plays AK and hits, and doesn't raise or reraise ever.

      The way I look at it this guy saved me some money by playing this way, the chances of me losing where slim to none with the line he was showing.
    • Jaissica
      Jaissica
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.02.2009 Posts: 1,385
      I really dont like the flat call on the turn simply because the board is still so wet. Are we going to call the blockbet on the turn, fold to a bigger river bet when a club makes it or an obvious straight card falls?

      Might as well raise and try and take the pot down right there, or make that flush drawer pay.

      Not much you can do when you run into station-passive player who plays call-along with AK. Just make a note on him and adjust your TPGK value bet range depending on what his VPIP turns out to be.
    • sliggy
      sliggy
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.10.2008 Posts: 196
      Originally posted by Verre
      Yeah my main reason for posting this was because everyone likes a good "WTF kind of line is that" moment when the guy slow plays AK and hits, and doesn't raise or reraise ever.

      The way I look at it this guy saved me some money by playing this way, the chances of me losing where slim to none with the line he was showing.
      Exactly. The loose passive fish never gets value for his hands :) You lost the minimum with your ace.
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      Originally posted by Jaissica
      Preflop - standard advised raise is 4BB. 60c gives the BB especially good odds to call with rubbishy hands.

      Flop is fine, its hardly a great cbet flop even for IP.

      Turn - As you said, some turn love. We still arnt in a really great situation however we should define our hand here. Raise it up to about $2.40 to push out drawers or crappy pairs. Bet-fold line as we dont often expect to be raised here except by aces-up (A3 A7 A6) or really bad slowplayers (slowplaying on very wet flop).

      On the river as played why call a small bet on the turn then escalate to a larger bet with our marignal top pair on the river? Check behind as played, not many worse hands can call, but plenty of better ones might.
      +1
      I would like to open 3,5bb pf (it is pot at full tilt poker)
      I think both 3 or 4bb are fine