How do you deal with hyper aggressive bigstacks on the bubble?

    • GunFlavoured
      GunFlavoured
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.10.2008 Posts: 626
      I've come across this situation a few times recently and I'm not sure if I am approaching it correctly. I play Full Tilts Super Turbos, basically ICM the whole time. Say there are three opponents 1000, 400, 150 and hero has 350 the blinds are something like 60/30. The big stack is pushing every hand.

      CO 150 FOLD
      BTN 1000 PUSH
      SB 400 FOLD
      BB (Hero) 350 ????

      I sometimes end up with hands like AJ AQ and know I'm well ahead of his range, do I still call even though CO is probably going to bust soon. If I fold, bigstack will push the next hand and I will lose 90 chips total + the shortstack has a chance of doubling up and I will then be shortstacked myself. If I push I am 65% chance to win but more importantly 35% chance to finish with $0! Personally, I call here but the amount of times I have been beaten by shit cards it makes me wonder if it is +EV$. How does everyone else deal with these situations?
  • 11 replies
    • JuliaJuli
      JuliaJuli
      Basic
      Joined: 22.08.2009 Posts: 1
      It`s depends on player. Some of them push atc ,but when on BB ,they fold on shove. I`m calling here very tight. AA,KK,AK(not sure) QQ,JJ,TT.
      In this situation it`s fold.There is short and SB will be short soon as well.Allways someone calling and get busted.
    • lennonac
      lennonac
      Global
      Joined: 02.05.2009 Posts: 1,421
      The answer is to keep folding, you gain next to nothing by doubling up through the big stack, you should be aiming your steals at the other small stacks
    • txfoyochipz
      txfoyochipz
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.07.2009 Posts: 32
      I think it's better to fold most hands here even AJ, AQ and maybe even AK. I would call with JJ+ tho.
      In your example, I would try to outlast the shortstack. The player 2nd in chips only has a few more chips than u, so u still have a decent chance of coming 2nd. However, if the SS doubles up and u become one of the shorties, I would loosen up my calling range to A10+, 77+, and even KQ.
      IMO it is usually better to try and fold ur way into the money when possible. I would rather use a well timed steal on the bubble than to call a push. Theres nothing worse than calling with AKs only to get beaten by 93 off and ending up with 0$.
    • lessthanthreee
      lessthanthreee
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.06.2009 Posts: 16,300
      calling QQ+ for me.

      calling a push without being the SS is very -$EV
    • LgWz
      LgWz
      Black
      Joined: 26.05.2007 Posts: 7,641
      Just get SNG Wizard and practice hand ranges.
    • NickParkes
      NickParkes
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.07.2008 Posts: 1,526
      Yeah... you gotta sometimes take your chances when you have the opportunity to push 1st in... you have to call tight... but most importantly, learn how to become the big stack and be that a$$hole no-one can call... it's probably one of the most fun elemnts of playing SNGs...
    • davodka
      davodka
      Bronze
      Joined: 20.10.2008 Posts: 61
      What about having it the other way around, with being the bigstack, and dealing with fishy midstacks on the bubble? e.g.

      CO - 500 fold
      BU - 200 fold
      SB - 1300 (Hero) push
      BB - 700

      30/60 or 40/80 blinds

      BB should fold and wait until the shortstack busts..... But fishy BB is calling much looser than JJ/QQ+, for example he is also calling A8o (and probably other weaker aces simply because he is a :f_eek: ), KJs, KQo ish and lower pocket pairs. Is it still profitable for hero to push ATC in SB, or does he need to adjust his range slightly? I hate pushing ATC here, getting being reduced to a midstack and ending up being the bubble boy all because of a bubble fish!
    • Flows
      Flows
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.03.2006 Posts: 543
      Originally posted by davodka
      What about having it the other way around, with being the bigstack, and dealing with fishy midstacks on the bubble? e.g.

      CO - 500 fold
      BU - 200 fold
      SB - 1300 (Hero) push
      BB - 700

      30/60 or 40/80 blinds

      BB should fold and wait until the shortstack busts..... But fishy BB is calling much looser than JJ/QQ+, for example he is also calling A8o (and probably other weaker aces simply because he is a :f_eek: ), KJs, KQo ish and lower pocket pairs. Is it still profitable for hero to push ATC in SB, or does he need to adjust his range slightly? I hate pushing ATC here, getting being reduced to a midstack and ending up being the bubble boy all because of a bubble fish!
    • viewer88
      viewer88
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.04.2008 Posts: 5,545
      Left one is a shove aswell, no way BB calls 19%
    • Flows
      Flows
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.03.2006 Posts: 543
      but he asked what to do if the BB calls KJs KQo. ( I know that calling 19% is crazy :D )
    • GunFlavoured
      GunFlavoured
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.10.2008 Posts: 626
      Originally posted by viewer88
      Left one is a shove aswell, no way BB calls 19%
      Yeah you think that but these players are so loose that I've come across even worse. Even though I find myself ahead in these situations I don't really want a 60/40 on the bubble. And the 40% always seems to hold up :(

      Another question: If my opponents are crazy loose, how well does ICM hold up? Do I need to tighten my range because they will call more often or should I stick with the ICM ranges and assume their mistakes will win me money in the long run? I seem to get sucked out a lot on the bubble even though I am following ICM ranges :(