How to eliminate emotions?

    • dember
      dember
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.04.2009 Posts: 158
      I realized that I am my worst enemy in poker. The reason: I have emotions. For example, I feel frustrated that I feel frustrated again after making that stupid mistake, the hope and fear that I feel influence my decision making. What is reading, re-reading articles and thoroughly analyzing my hands worth when I actually don't apply what I learned because my emotions interfere with my (humanly) objective decision making?
      I don't need emotions, I don't need feelings. How to eliminate them, or reduce their effect? Any viable ideas?
  • 23 replies
    • Dippy19
      Dippy19
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.12.2007 Posts: 1,346
      http://www.tapping.com/
    • ZhiCheng
      ZhiCheng
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.10.2008 Posts: 2,294
      I was having similar problems as you.
      If you have similar personality like me, then its gonna be tough and not sure if it ever will be completely ok :)
      But, I can see on myself that i keep getting better in it everyday.. and the answer is simple..
      GRIND SO HARD U WONT REALIZE WHAT IS BLACK AND WHAT IS WHITE.. and then you will start to care less :)
    • NightFrostaSS
      NightFrostaSS
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.10.2008 Posts: 5,255
      Originally posted by GooRukYONG

      FAP SO HARD U WONT REALIZE WHAT IS BLACK AND WHAT IS WHITE..
      fyp
    • THeGaME23
      THeGaME23
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.10.2009 Posts: 398
      Play a lot of tables at once and just play basic strats.... If you lose you know that it was just bad luck and in the long run you made the correct decision. This is how I look at it. It is hard sometimes though when your aces and kings start to get cracked over and over though. Thats when I take a break lol
    • deVall3y
      deVall3y
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.01.2009 Posts: 554
      if you are upset over your mistakes, work hard on fixing them :D
    • Ejeckt
      Ejeckt
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.12.2008 Posts: 517
      IMO emotions aren't the problem. Everyone gets emotional, it's an unavoidable element of the human body and psyche. The day you see your quad's beaten by quad's, and feel nothing, is the day you should consider getting some help :D

      It's what you do with those emotions that matters. Either channel them into some expressive form that is good for you, or work through them until the energy they created is spent (things like daily excercise work here).

      Emotional mastery isn't about denying certain or all emotions, it's about overcoming them. The very definition of having a high EQ (Emotional Intelligence Quotient) is having a high degree of ability or skill to assess, manage, cope, deal with, and identify certain emotional characteristics within yourself.

      If you have any friends studying postgrad Psychology in the Industrial/Organisational, Educational, Forensic or Personality disciplines (Those are the main applied psychology fields) ask them about EQ/EI. Or do some research of your own. Don't ask a clinical, abmornal, general, etc psychologist about it, though. Those guys have no idea what they're talking about. And do not use self-help sites like Dippy quoted (though I suspect that was just a joke) :P Work out your own model for handling emotions.
    • ImAnAcehole9
      ImAnAcehole9
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.10.2009 Posts: 128
      The best and easiest method I have found is to just be happy with your decision regardless of the outcome.

      For example: If you have played a hand perfectly (in your mind) from start to finish but lose well you could do no better, maybe review the hand at a later date and see if there are any improvement to your game to be made but be happy with your decision.

      Your decision to call/fold is gauged from your experience and if you are angry frustrated I would say it is because you may lack experience to know that over the long run that decision you made (let's say it's the best decision at the time) would pay off more often than not. Isn't that what pokers all about anyway, playing the odds so they fall in your favour in the long run.

      I made a bluff at a large pot recently against a very good player (we have a poker history/nemisis) during a live finals tourney recently. Before I did it I knew I was going to bluff the pot after I saw the flop.

      I was holding A J and called a position raise from this player. The flop came down 8s 10s 7d, I checked the player led out 3/4 of the pot, I tanked for a while and thought he has QQ or KK, I made the decision then and there that I could get him off his hand but realized I was taking a big risk. This was going to cost me pretty much everything if it was seen through to showdown but ran the scenarios in my head that at worst case I pictured myself losing and going home but was happy with my decision to push him or try to push him off his hand so I flat called. The turn produced the best possible scare card for my bluffing 6s, there was now a flush and a straight on the board, I led out betting 70% of his stack which was less than his raise on the turn. This put a huge amount of pressure on him and he ultimately folded and showed Kh Kc.

      The point to the story is that I made a decision however bad it was and saw it through. If it hadn't worked out, yeah I would be dissapointed with me being an idiot but I could live with my decision. I made the decision and accepted the consequence of it.

      P.S why would you want to eliminate your emotions anyway........can you just imagine a few years down the track playing in the WSOP 2015 and make final table........

      with emotion:

      You eliminate 3 quarters of the table and running hot, you are invincible and look around for a phone booth to change into your Superman outfit. Your only competion on the table is some noob named Phil Hellmuth who eliminates the other numptys.

      You're playing heads up with Phil Helmuth (in your Superman outfit), you can't believe it, your heart starts racing as put your 250,000 big blind out and look down at 3s 6s. Phil raises to 750,00 your mouth goes dry and your stomach feels like there's an elephant standing on it. You make the call and the board flops 4s 5s Ad. You check, Phil leads out 1.2 million, you tank the elephant feels like it is carrying Kryptonite and your heart is about to pop a valve but make the call. The turn brings 7s (the straight flush baby!!) you check and Phil quickly checks.........all is lost ;( you feel gutted, the gigs over. The turn brings the Ac, you throw out a value bet but that elephant is long gone and your heart returns to it's useless restful state. All of a sudden Phil announces "I'm all in" what!! you have him covered, the elphant has returned with other elephant friends and spraying $100 bills at you from thier trunks, you jizz in your pants and call...You are the WSOP 2015 winner!!!

      Without Emotion:

      Um, I won.....great. Where can I get something to eat.

      PSS. For anyone wondering what Phil reveals his hand to be after fist pumping the sky when you call it was....................................pocket 2's
    • davodka
      davodka
      Bronze
      Joined: 20.10.2008 Posts: 61
      I don't even think happiness comes into it. I think its more becoming self aware, and determining for yourself whether the decision you make is profitable to begin with based on the information you have...

      I think you need to be completely 100% interested in every decision that you make (whether it be limp, call, raise, push of fold), from the sole point of view that ultimately every decision that you eventually want to make will be profitable, since this will determine your long term profitability. You can play 1, 2 or 12 tables or whatever, provided that you UNDERSTAND exactly what you are doing, and why.

      From a sporting point of view, professional athletes are winners because they base their decisions on objective action rather than emotional reaction. If they think that in a situation that they will win by choosing a certain option, then they will pursue that option regardless on their feelings on that choice. The main emotion that they will have in this case is the pressure of losing an event (which causes negative feelings and hence doubt), whereas in our case it is the pressure of winning or losing money based on our decision (which causes us to behave differently in certain circumstances).

      Only the players who act objectively rather than emotionally can continually make the decisions that will win them the most money in the long run.

      With regards to poker I suggest that you continually analyze your game and become VERY interested in the decisions that you make, from the point of bettering your poker game rather than making money. By making more profitable decisions you WILL win more money..... If you think you are making a bad decision, or basing your decisions on feelings rather than current information that you have, ask fellow poker strategists the same question by posting hands in the evaluation forums to see if you are correct or not....
    • clarkie1989
      clarkie1989
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.07.2008 Posts: 22
      Originally posted by ImAnAcehole9

      with emotion:

      You eliminate 3 quarters of the table and running hot, you are invincible and look around for a phone booth to change into your Superman outfit. Your only competion on the table is some noob named Phil Hellmuth who eliminates the other numptys.

      You're playing heads up with Phil Helmuth (in your Superman outfit), you can't believe it, your heart starts racing as put your 250,000 big blind out and look down at 3s 6s. Phil raises to 750,00 your mouth goes dry and your stomach feels like there's an elephant standing on it. You make the call and the board flops 4s 5s Ad. You check, Phil leads out 1.2 million, you tank the elephant feels like it is carrying Kryptonite and your heart is about to pop a valve but make the call. The turn brings 7s (the straight flush baby!!) you check and Phil quickly checks.........all is lost ;( you feel gutted, the gigs over. The turn brings the Ac, you throw out a value bet but that elephant is long gone and your heart returns to it's useless restful state. All of a sudden Phil announces "I'm all in" what!! you have him covered, the elphant has returned with other elephant friends and spraying $100 bills at you from thier trunks, you jizz in your pants and call...You are the WSOP 2015 winner!!!

      Without Emotion:

      Um, I won.....great. Where can I get something to eat.

      PSS. For anyone wondering what Phil reveals his hand to be after fist pumping the sky when you call it was....................................pocket 2's
      utterly genius :f_biggrin:
    • dember
      dember
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.04.2009 Posts: 158
      Thank you Ejeckt, ImAnAcehole9 and davodka for your replies. They helped a lot. A lot.
      I think all of my negative emotions came from not viewing poker from a probabilistic point of view. For example when I hit my two pair (and I felt warm and fuzzy inside) on the flop and pushed all-in I translated my let's say 70% winning chance to 100% winning - that's why when the guy hit his runner-runner flush on the river I was so disappointed and started to whine ("Why me? Why now? Why again against this ace-hole :) "), spiraling into self-distruct mode.
      The simple solution I found is that I always have to be aware of the probabilistic nature of poker and not expect to win for sure if I don't have the actual nuts.
      These days when I hold my dear pocket aces and look at the flop I am thinking - ok, so what can bust me?
      No expecting anything but taking responsibility for everything is the key.

      The description of the 2015 WSOP with Phil HELLmuth was hilarious. I guess after my straight flush he will launch his tirade about my Eastern European accent :-)

      I already feel like I am there. Just a little work everyday and who knows...
    • ImAnAcehole9
      ImAnAcehole9
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.10.2009 Posts: 128
      Hi Dember,

      I regards to your example

      "when I hit my two pair (and I felt warm and fuzzy inside) on the flop and pushed all-in I translated my let's say 70% winning chance to 100% winning - that's why when the guy hit his runner-runner flush on the river I was so disappointed and started to whine ("Why me? Why now? Why again against this ace-hole "), spiraling into self-distruct mode."

      Just remmber this:

      All the money that is won and lost is shared amongst players at that site, your bad beat from an inexperienced player in the long run will be passed onto and experienced player, the cylce continues and continues. So the only thing this inexperienced player has cost you is some time because you know that in the long run your experience and knowledge will return that money lost with interest!

      When you lose a pot to a bad beat, hit the sit out button and walk away from your computer for a minute or so and laugh.... I mean it laugh and feel sorry for the idiot player who called you down needing runner runner to win because he has deposited over 2k over the last few months, it is people like him that make winning money online so lucrative. Another thing worth mentioning too is turn your chat off! don't even give this guy a lesson of how stupid that call was etc etc.

      Hope this helps a little.....I learnt the hard way and did everything completely opposite to what I am writing here and lost money hand over fist player angry and frustrated.......it doesn't work, walk away regain your composure and after a while you will find you rarely tilt in fact after a bad beat live I have laughed at my opponent who responded with "why are you laughing I have your chips", I said I am laughing because I feel sorry for you, I'm sorry that you thought you were ahead when you put your tournament life on the line with your all in call, I'm glad you can sometimes be lucky but I feel sorry for you because I made you think you had the best hand when you called, and left it at that.
    • Janusrichmond
      Janusrichmond
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.07.2009 Posts: 2,432
      It´s not good to laught at your oponent that makes bad decisions. Instead: give him cred when he outdraws you, let him think that he made a good play. Then he will do it again and again, and soon you own all hos money ;)
    • davecc
      davecc
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.10.2009 Posts: 72
      "the elphant has returned with other elephant friends and spraying $100 bills at you from thier trunks, you jizz in your pants"
    • davecc
      davecc
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.10.2009 Posts: 72
      I had quite a few bad beats yesterday, going all in on the flop with a set to lose to runners, and then going all in pre-flop with AA against a noob who had 8Q

      I thanked both for calling and put a note down, as I happily re-bought. Most things dont bug me in poker, although if Ive been losing a lot I can get frustrated and open my game up to all kinds of mistakes on top of the unintentional ones. I usually just close out at that point, or once I go all in with a nice hand I close the game without looking and that makes me feel better.
    • thebigheizung85
      thebigheizung85
      Silver
      Joined: 12.08.2006 Posts: 195
      according to a friend of mine Q8 is the most underrated hand in poker... so it is no surprise to me that Q8 wins against AA... that is hardly a badbeat but more a lack of general poker knowledge, n00b!

      But to be serious, i loved a lot of concepts that were posted here, but nothing in the way like berating your opponent or laughing... instead say: wow, i had no clue you could have that hand, really unpredictable... the fish will love to hear that and start playing with all sorts of unpredictable garbage hands... if you can't put out that lie with a serious face (in a live game) just be quiet
    • Woohoooo
      Woohoooo
      Silver
      Joined: 15.08.2009 Posts: 899
      I want to thank you all for the great tips, it will help alot! :D
      I just hope that I won't tilt for like the fifth time (been angry the previous 4 times :P )
      Probably doable if i look at the game in this way :)
    • mrjorisa
      mrjorisa
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.03.2008 Posts: 200
      if all else fails, drinking will do the trick :)
    • excelgeo
      excelgeo
      Silver
      Joined: 17.10.2008 Posts: 1,107
      observe:

      holding the nuts on the river:





      losing to an 1 outer on the river:





      hope this helps
    • excelgeo
      excelgeo
      Silver
      Joined: 17.10.2008 Posts: 1,107
      on a more serious note, judge every hand independently unless you are on the same table, then history between 2 players could be of importance.


      and if even if you lose to bad beats 5 times in a row think about how many hands youve played and what 5 hands really mean in the grand scheme of things. at the end of the day you can only hope to play correctly and it will sort itself out.
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