KK's - push or fold?

    • Termis
      Termis
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.07.2007 Posts: 149
      In NL5, sometime ago, I was "lucky" enough to get quite few pocket kings in short amount of time. Of course my play was raise/reraise or push it in, however all those times ( i think 4 times) when I pushed all in preflop, I got beat by AA. I know shit happens, but that gave me a thought and a fear of KK's.

      Should I think twice before pushing in? What would be right play if let's say tight player reraises you in this situation?
  • 12 replies
    • KidPokersKid
      KidPokersKid
      Global
      Joined: 27.02.2009 Posts: 653
      With KK the only hand you dont want to see is AA, so that is 1/169 hands that you hope he doesnt have, so your telling me your going to not put the money in when your always ahead because of that one hand?
    • Termis
      Termis
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.07.2007 Posts: 149
      What I'm saying, if you get reraised by super tight players, maybe I should think twice before blindly pushing it in? I'm not talking about every player out there, but the ones, that you know are really tight.
    • KidPokersKid
      KidPokersKid
      Global
      Joined: 27.02.2009 Posts: 653
      If you don't want to push why would you 3bet?
    • chuongdk
      chuongdk
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.03.2009 Posts: 210
      always all-in with any kind of super tight
    • kosmonaut111
      kosmonaut111
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.01.2009 Posts: 715
      In PS forums are quite a few threads about folding KK preflop. Dont fold it preflop. You can think twice but you push it eventually.
    • advola
      advola
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.06.2009 Posts: 361
      In nl5 there are no super tight
      even if they think they are they aren't!

      push even a 1000bb stack without thinking again

      i will push it in nl 1k to
    • kennyxx
      kennyxx
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.05.2008 Posts: 998
      Originally posted by Termis
      What I'm saying, if you get reraised by super tight players, maybe I should think twice before blindly pushing it in? I'm not talking about every player out there, but the ones, that you know are really tight.
      Well, tell me what would You do after calling his 3bet/4bet preflop. On dry boards You won't fold KK anyway. But there are some bad flops for KK, like AQx. And it's way easier to push KK preflop than play them on ugly boards :)
    • LucasFistro
      LucasFistro
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.05.2008 Posts: 593
      Raise. If re-raised, 3 bet/All-in, depending of your stack and his.

      Only with a deep stack, once the flop is dealt, and the board shows something like xAx, and I am pretty sure he's got the Ace because the way the opponent bets (he's not scared of the A and continue betting) only in that case I fold KK.

      Never preflop.

      Only after a flop Axx, or rare flops like 567 suited and I haven't got the suited cards.....I would say 5 % of times, no more. The rest 95 % I go ahead.
    • Termis
      Termis
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.07.2007 Posts: 149
      by 4betting all in preflop i lost with KK's around 40$. laugh it up, but i belive shoving it in nl5 FR is a mistake. noone but AA will call your 4bet. And they 3bet almost with only AA.
    • lennonac
      lennonac
      Global
      Joined: 02.05.2009 Posts: 1,421
      lol,
      Folding KK to a 4 bet is a huge leak, I hope i get to play you :f_biggrin:
    • roswellx
      roswellx
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.12.2008 Posts: 599
      You can only consider folding KK when there are 2 players all in before you and you are shortstacked in a tournament at the bubble stage. Otherwise FR/SH/HU doesn't matter... From 1,326 starting hands only 6 of them AA. Do whatever you can to get your stack in preflop. Don't change/question your style for only 4-5 bad beats...

      Check this out (Outcome wouldn't change if I bet the pot every street):

      Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:

      Play hand

      $0.1/$0.25 No-Limit Hold'em (6 handed)

      Known players:
      MP3:
      $23.94
      CO:
      $41.64
      BU:
      $29.51
      SB:
      $36.17
      BB:
      $26.41
      MP2(Hero):
      $31.25


      Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K, K.
      Hero raises to $1.00, MP3 folds, CO calls $1.00, BU folds, SB calls $0.90, BB calls $0.75.

      Flop: ($4) 5, A, K (4 players)
      SB checks, BB folds, Hero bets $2.50, CO calls $2.50, SB folds.

      Turn: ($9) 7 (2 players)
      Hero bets $4.50, CO calls $4.50.

      River: ($18) A (2 players)
      Hero bets $12.00, CO raises to $33.64(All-In), Hero calls $11.25(All-In).

      Final Pot: $74.89.

      Results follow:

      Hero shows a full-house, kings full of aces(K K).
      CO shows a full-house, aces full of sevens(A 7).

      CO wins with a full-house, aces full of sevens(A 7).
    • OnkelHotte
      OnkelHotte
      Black
      Joined: 16.01.2005 Posts: 18,432
      Hey guys,

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