Non-showdown winnings are ripping out my guts from the inside

    • PetterG2
      PetterG2
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.10.2008 Posts: 224
      I am currently playing NL5sh with a margial profit. I beat the limit with around 5-6bb/100 over 40k hands, which I think is terible at this limit. I've spent some hours in holdemmanager now, and can't find anything else than that my non-showdown winnings are horrible. I know the non-showdown winnings are negative for most winning people at nanostackes, but I have negative profit on roughly 13bb/100. This has to be way to much, isn't it?

      After looking around in holdemmanager I've come up with some idea to reduce the money lost to non-showdown hands:


        Stop c-betting OOP, unless they have a very high fold to c-bet%
        Stop c-betting unknowns
        Stop c-betting player who aren't fully stacked as they often are bad and passive.
        Stop c-betting at all, unless the same as the first suggestion is the case.
        Never c-bet in multiway pot unless I got a hand/ok draw


      Here are some useful stats as well:

      16.7/12.2/2.6 - standard stats
      Flop c-bet - 70 %
      Fold to flop c-bet 61 %
      Turn c-bet% - 38 %
      Fold to turn c-bet 37%
      vs 3bet call% - 27.8
      Fold flop vs c-bet - 61.3%
      Flop c-bet% success vs 1 - 51%

      I'll be very thanksful for any tips, help and suggestions!

      Edit: Just noticed I posted this thread in the General Poker Discussion, could a moderator please move it to NL-discusson. Thx
  • 5 replies
    • ladman
      ladman
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.04.2009 Posts: 289
      is this sss?
    • PetterG2
      PetterG2
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.10.2008 Posts: 224
      Originally posted by ladman
      is this sss?
      No, NL5sh BSS
    • wquinn636
      wquinn636
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.10.2009 Posts: 64
      You're talking about betting $7 to win $10 when 70% of the time your opponent hasn't hit the flop.

      Personally I'd look for gaps in your game elsewhere.
    • kingdippy2008
      kingdippy2008
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.08.2008 Posts: 2,107
      Moved this thread to an appropiate section.

      Good luck and best regards,

      -Jack
    • Fongie
      Fongie
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.12.2006 Posts: 4,978
      5-6bb/100 is fine, non-sd winnings are supposed to be negative on these lower limits (well, normally) and your flop cbet should definately not be lower than 70%. However, you should stop c-betting without a hand in multiway pots.

      Your preflop stats are nitty, but you should be fine playing like this on nl5-10(25). It definately wouldn't hurt to start opening up a bit already though, most likely with isolation raises(!) and blind steals.

      Your call 3bet is sort of high, there's no reason to call losely on nl5 because they aren't going to be bluffingraising preflop very much.

      All your money is going to be made by valuebetting. This most likely involves improving your handreading so you know when to squeeze in those extra valuebets or not (often on the river).