Bronze Artikel advanced preflop play

    • SoWe
      SoWe
      Global
      Joined: 10.01.2008 Posts: 2,397
      http://www.pokerstrategy.com/strategy/fixed-limit/793/1

      Doesn't say what to do when someone raises behind you, or if there is more than one raise behind you.

      Also: you never enter the hand by calling when everybody folded in front of you, unless you're the SB?

      So? ô_O


      another question:
      suppose you are UTG1 with a suited non-connector hand, UTG calls.
      The chart "Actions against callers in front of you - Calling/Raising" says Call with QTs, raise with QJs+ (since there is 1 caller), but nothing below ATs+,KQs+ is in the "first in" chart, so you should fold (instead of raising) eg QJs, but still call with QTs? That makes no sense to me.
  • 6 replies
    • Dawnfall26
      Dawnfall26
      Black
      Joined: 30.07.2008 Posts: 3,116
      Hi!

      1. When there is 1 raise behind you,you always call(you will always be given the correct odds to continue)

      2.When there is a raise and a reraise behind you it gets a little bit more difficult. As a begginer you only continue to play your very strong hands(QQ+,AKs,AKo) .If this is happening in a bit later possitions(for ex. Hero MP2 raises,CO 3-bet,SB cap) you can also play your strong hands(99+,AQs,AQo,AJs). When you will get better and more expirienced you will be able to play more hands. I suggest patiance here:)

      3. It is one of the basic principles to always raise when everybody folded( this is called FIRST IN) even in the SB. As a begginer I strongly suggest sticking to this rule 100% as it will get you discipline and you will make much less mistakes!
      PS.: I would also move QTs(in the chart actions against 1 caller) to being raised from being called

      4. If there is a limper(caller) in front of you,your hand must now meet a new criteria( or whatever that is spelled:) ) a) your hand has to be in FIRST IN chart b) your hand needs to have an equity edge against limpers range
      c) you always play raise or fold!!! against just one caller

      EX.:1 UTG calls, Hero QTs in UTG1 folds(hand is not in FIRST IN CHART
      2 UTG calls, Hero QTs in CO raises (in both charts)
      3.UTG calls, Hero K3s IN BU folds (hand does not have equity on limper)


      Hope it helps:)
    • SoWe
      SoWe
      Global
      Joined: 10.01.2008 Posts: 2,397
      Originally posted by Dawnfall26
      4. If there is a limper(caller) in front of you,your hand must now meet a new criteria( or whatever that is spelled:) ) a) your hand has to be in FIRST IN chart b) your hand needs to have an equity edge against limpers range
      c) you always play raise or fold!!! against just one caller

      EX.:1 UTG calls, Hero QTs in UTG1 folds(hand is not in FIRST IN CHART
      2 UTG calls, Hero QTs in CO raises (in both charts)
      3.UTG calls, Hero K3s IN BU folds (hand does not have equity on limper)
      Thank you for this reply! I see that you are already an experienced player and your opinion (raise/fold against 1 limper) makes sense. But what was the reasoning of the ppl who made the bronze-SHC, in which they state that you sometimes call against 1 limper, even if the hand is not in the first-in-chart? Or am I understanding the following sentence wrong:
      Hands,[sic] that should be raised according to this chart, also need to be listed in the first-in chart for you to raise them. Otherwise you should fold.
      emphasis by me
    • Dawnfall26
      Dawnfall26
      Black
      Joined: 30.07.2008 Posts: 3,116
      Hi!

      If I remember correctly I dont recall any hand in any chart that should be openlimped(called) as FIRST IN.

      Calling/raising chart against 1 limper is not totaly accurate.With hands like JTs or QTs you can easily isolate 1 limper as playability of these hands is very good. Actually I see overlimp with JTs often a quite big mistake(as you dont get enough Fold equity which this hand needs)

      The sentance you wrote means that if you want to isolate 1 limper your hand must be listed also in FIRST IN chart,otherwise you should fold.
    • SoWe
      SoWe
      Global
      Joined: 10.01.2008 Posts: 2,397
      Originally posted by Dawnfall26
      Hi!

      If I remember correctly I dont recall any hand in any chart that should be openlimped(called) as FIRST IN.
      Yes, I understand that now.

      Originally posted by Dawnfall26
      Calling/raising chart against 1 limper is not totaly accurate.With hands like JTs or QTs you can easily isolate 1 limper as playability of these hands is very good. Actually I see overlimp with JTs often a quite big mistake(as you dont get enough Fold equity which this hand needs)

      The sentance you wrote means that if you want to isolate 1 limper your hand must be listed also in FIRST IN chart,otherwise you should fold.
      So you're saying that all the hands that the chart says to call with against 1 limper should instead be raised or folded, yes? In early positions the latter, in late positions the former?


      Thanks again for your time and help!
    • Dawnfall26
      Dawnfall26
      Black
      Joined: 30.07.2008 Posts: 3,116
      I hope you understand that the chart means xx/yy.....xx are calling hands and yy are raising hands. So under the column for 1 limper there are only yy hands(except JTs,QTs which should be move onto yy) so you never overlimp here:)
    • SoWe
      SoWe
      Global
      Joined: 10.01.2008 Posts: 2,397
      Originally posted by Dawnfall26
      I hope you understand that the chart means xx/yy.....xx are calling hands and yy are raising hands. So under the column for 1 limper there are only yy hands(except JTs,QTs which should be move onto yy) so you never overlimp here:)
      Yep, understood that. And that was exactly my question in the last post, what to do with the "xx" hands in the 1-limper section of the chart, since you advised to play raise/fold against 1 limper, contrary to what the chart states.
      Thx!