Braking the rules.

    • PushMeUp
      PushMeUp
      Basic
      Joined: 20.02.2010 Posts: 56
      Hello everyone.

      The limit and game type I play at is $1 + $0.20 and 9 seater Sit & Go's. After playing around six tournaments, winning one and bubbling on every other at the push or fold stage I decided to break the rules. I was fed up of playing idiot poker against people who will call your raise with something as silly as J4 off. So I played at a $5 + $0.50 9 seater Sit & Go to see if the competition is a lot harder than at lower limits. I came second in the tournament cashing $13.50, which was quite a good result although my QQ didn't hold up against AJ for the win.

      I know that I shouldn't of done this but it was out of sheer curiosity and I found out that when I play against seemingly better opponents, not only do I try harder but I seem to pick the right spots and play well in each situation. I feel like I made the correct folds and I know that nearly every showdown I came across I won. So all in all it was a good experiance.

      To set things straight though I doubt i'm going to be doing this again in a long time and I don't think because I got second place in the tournament that I can do it again and again but the only thing I questioned was that when you play against more intelligent players who do not play at micro stakes you find that you can actually result in thinking how you should when playing poker. Whilst playing micro stakes for a long time you notice people get extreemly lucky, whereas people who play at slightly higher stakes know what they are doing in most situations.

      Anybody else tried playing at a higher limit for the experiance, if so what happened?
  • 15 replies
    • ZhiCheng
      ZhiCheng
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.10.2008 Posts: 2,294
      did it, tried 50+5FR sngs for experience /with 70bucks brm/, hit a heater, cash out 700, tried again.. got pwned.. realized "silly idiots" who call and raise J4 are much easier to play against
    • woopstash
      woopstash
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.01.2010 Posts: 94
      Originally posted by PushMeUp
      I was fed up of playing idiot poker against people who will call your raise with something as silly as J4 off.
      Wouldn't this make it easier to win? Shove it when your ahead and you're going to win most of the time.

      Stick to BRM. If you can't dominate the 1$ tables your surely not going to fare better in the 6$ tables, unless of course you have previous SNG experience (several thousand games) which it doesn't sound like you do.
    • AugustusCaesar
      AugustusCaesar
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.05.2008 Posts: 377
      Originally posted by PushMeUp
      Hello everyone.

      The limit and game type I play at is $1 + $0.20 and 9 seater Sit & Go's. After playing around six tournaments, winning one and bubbling on every other at the push or fold stage I decided to break the rules. I was fed up of playing idiot poker against people who will call your raise with something as silly as J4 off. So I played at a $5 + $0.50 9 seater Sit & Go to see if the competition is a lot harder than at lower limits. I came second in the tournament cashing $13.50, which was quite a good result although my QQ didn't hold up against AJ for the win.

      I know that I shouldn't of done this but it was out of sheer curiosity and I found out that when I play against seemingly better opponents, not only do I try harder but I seem to pick the right spots and play well in each situation. I feel like I made the correct folds and I know that nearly every showdown I came across I won. So all in all it was a good experiance.

      To set things straight though I doubt i'm going to be doing this again in a long time and I don't think because I got second place in the tournament that I can do it again and again but the only thing I questioned was that when you play against more intelligent players who do not play at micro stakes you find that you can actually result in thinking how you should when playing poker. Whilst playing micro stakes for a long time you notice people get extreemly lucky, whereas people who play at slightly higher stakes know what they are doing in most situations.

      Anybody else tried playing at a higher limit for the experiance, if so what happened?
      Think about it this way .. Out of tons of people that try SNGs only a few will play as many of them to know if they really can play it .. If you take poker as a fun thing, do whatever you want .. If you take poker seriously, grind your way up with good BRM, or even better, deposit your own money and start at higher if you want .. I recommend a very long stay at the micros so you will see what can and will happen to you .. And by very long I mean at least 2k games .. If you are serious about poker, it will take you like 1-2 months of grinding .. Now what is that compared to a lifetime ;)
    • MrMardyBum
      MrMardyBum
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.03.2009 Posts: 2,206
      Or think of it this way.....

      No. DON'T BREAK BRM RULES!

      Simple.

      The Mardy One
    • PushMeUp
      PushMeUp
      Basic
      Joined: 20.02.2010 Posts: 56
      Originally posted by AugustusCaesar
      Think about it this way .. Out of tons of people that try SNGs only a few will play as many of them to know if they really can play it .. If you take poker as a fun thing, do whatever you want .. If you take poker seriously, grind your way up with good BRM, or even better, deposit your own money and start at higher if you want .. I recommend a very long stay at the micros so you will see what can and will happen to you .. And by very long I mean at least 2k games .. If you are serious about poker, it will take you like 1-2 months of grinding .. Now what is that compared to a lifetime ;)
      A few weeks back I tried grinding $1 + $0.20 9 seater Sit & Go's, usually playing 2-4 tables at once. I usually bubble and would get harshly sucked out on. [B]Is there actually any tips on grinding apart from the obvious strategy itself?[B] (Play tight early, once you have around 14 big blinds play more aggressive, towards the late phase where blinds are huge and you've got less than 13 big blinds move in to [I]shove or fold[I] mode). Usually i'd hit the occasional premium hand and either get no action or somebody would hit a very lucky flop.
    • fulja
      fulja
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.04.2009 Posts: 235
      I'd say you have a problem understanding ICM...missing out spots where you can push profitably (while waiting to get a premium hand) is a great way of bubbling in a great amount of SNG's played. And i think that's the biggest problem for a lot of players playing those games.

      Try downloading pokerstrategy ICM trainer light and after you pass all the tests there, download ICM trainer and just practice practice practice.

      It will probably be weird at first to fold AK in some spots and to shove K9 in others, but soon you'll get the grasp of it. How it works, and why it works.

      Good luck :)
    • PushMeUp
      PushMeUp
      Basic
      Joined: 20.02.2010 Posts: 56
      Originally posted by fulja
      I'd say you have a problem understanding ICM...missing out spots where you can push profitably (while waiting to get a premium hand) is a great way of bubbling in a great amount of SNG's played. And i think that's the biggest problem for a lot of players playing those games.

      Try downloading pokerstrategy ICM trainer light and after you pass all the tests there, download ICM trainer and just practice practice practice.

      It will probably be weird at first to fold AK in some spots and to shove K9 in others, but soon you'll get the grasp of it. How it works, and why it works.

      Good luck :)
      I passed all the tests on ICM light a while a go. I might start using ICM trainer a lot more, see if I can get the whole grasp of it all more. I feel I h ave good knowledge with the push or fold stage. I know when to fold and shove, usually when I do shove I have the best hand 90% of the time, unless I shove first and somebody picks up a sick hand and it holds up. Obviously people make mistakes but I think I know when to fold and when not to.

      I'm up for some sweat sessions on Skype with someone, we can watch eachother play in micro stake tournaments and analyse eachothers play. If anybody is up for it add me on Skype: PushMeUpPoker.
    • tokyoaces
      tokyoaces
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.04.2009 Posts: 1,883
      If you life situation provides you with enough spare money to re-deposit into your poker account then feel free to play whatever you want whenever you want. After all your real bankroll is whatever you say it is.

      However, if you can't beat the $1 SNGs for a positive ROI then you probably can't beat the higher limit ones at all.

      There's an old, pre-internet poker saying about how you will always pay for your poker education. The question is do you want to pay for it $1 at a time or $5 ?
    • purplefizz
      purplefizz
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.03.2008 Posts: 4,508
      Originally posted by MrMardyBum
      Or think of it this way.....

      No. DON'T BREAK BRM RULES!

      Simple.

      The Mardy One
      unless ur name happens to be ihufa.
      then u can screw BRM.
    • PushMeUp
      PushMeUp
      Basic
      Joined: 20.02.2010 Posts: 56
      Originally posted by tokyoaces
      If you life situation provides you with enough spare money to re-deposit into your poker account then feel free to play whatever you want whenever you want. After all your real bankroll is whatever you say it is.

      However, if you can't beat the $1 SNGs for a positive ROI then you probably can't beat the higher limit ones at all.

      There's an old, pre-internet poker saying about how you will always pay for your poker education. The question is do you want to pay for it $1 at a time or $5 ?
      This may sound really odd and stupid - I prefer to play with people who have a great knowledge of poker. When playing against idiots they could call a raise of up to five times the big blind with something as silly as J4 offsuit, and believe me that's happened to me too many times, haha. Too be honest I don't have much spare money but when it comes to poker, well for me, I play more consistantly against better players. Maybe because I take it a lot more seriously, I don't know but at the moment it seems that way. When I play at lower stakes I bubble nearly all the time when i'm doing the right things, maybe it's just one huge downswing who knows?
    • fulja
      fulja
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.04.2009 Posts: 235
      The most important thing is not to move up where they respect your raises....it's not a valid reason to move up....playing where people are calling your all ins with all those crappy hands is where you will usually win most of your chips. Just think of that...

      I really don't see how moving up can make any sense in your head because if you can't manage a positive ROI while playing 1$ SNGs how can you expect to crush higher limits where players are by all means better. Maybe not by much, but better for sure.

      I'm not trying to bash you here or anything...just trying to advise you to move up the limits as fast as you learn the game and get better. It's just a smart thing to do.

      Look around and you'll see a lot examples of people blowing their bankrolls cause of playing higher limits that they were not ready or rolled for. Myself included...

      Remember, going all in with a better hand is not a 100% chance of winning that hand. Sometimes they suck out, every other time you win. Logic is flawless here....having idiot players calling your all ins with crappy hands means just they'll suck out on you less than better players on higher limits that will call you only when it's +EV for them to do so.

      I think this is what most players don't get from the start. 80/20 doesn't mean you will always get his chips ;)
    • tokyoaces
      tokyoaces
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.04.2009 Posts: 1,883
      There is no limit where some guy isn't going to call your raise with J4o. If you don't believe me watch a player named "Durrrr" play the nosebleeds.
    • MrMardyBum
      MrMardyBum
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.03.2009 Posts: 2,206
      Originally posted by tokyoaces
      There is no limit where some guy isn't going to call your raise with J4o. If you don't believe me watch a player named "Durrrr" play the nosebleeds.
      Legend :D
    • PushMeUp
      PushMeUp
      Basic
      Joined: 20.02.2010 Posts: 56
      Originally posted by tokyoaces
      There is no limit where some guy isn't going to call your raise with J4o. If you don't believe me watch a player named "Durrrr" play the nosebleeds.
      Haha. I'm starting to think a lot more whilst playing tournaments, thinking about opponents ranges, what type of player they are both pre and post-flop, how they bet and what with, etc. Now I know which players are loose and which are tight I can therefore think about when and how much I raise to extract the most value. I used PokerStrategy Sit & Go technique where you play tight at the start, although I sometimes limp in the pot if I have position with a high suited connected such as JT. When it comes to the middle stages I play more aggressively without risking too many chips but, again, I try and exert the most value out of my hand if I hit anything good enough. And obviously the late stages, which in my opinion are most important, where you are either shoving or folding - I think i'm improving rapidly in these stages thanks to ICM trainer and Sit n Go wizard.
    • shane0878
      shane0878
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.06.2009 Posts: 164
      Originally posted by MrMardyBum
      Originally posted by tokyoaces
      There is no limit where some guy isn't going to call your raise with J4o. If you don't believe me watch a player named "Durrrr" play the nosebleeds.
      Legend :D
      And don't forget good old Gus.
      http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x8rhfn_wpt-gus-hansen-call-de-l%C3%A9gende_sport