[NL2-NL10] Instructional sample hands #8

  • Poll
    • What is the best play here?

      • 23
        bet $5
        41%
      • 15
        bet $4
        27%
      • 8
        check
        14%
      • 8
        bet $6
        14%
      • 2
        fold
        4%
      • 0
        bet $3
        0%
      Total: 56 Votes
    • Puschkin81
      Puschkin81
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.04.2006 Posts: 4,786
      „Play big pots with big hands and small pots with small hands.“ What about this hand?

      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      Hero:
      $26,46
      UTG+1:
      $18,22

      0,10/0,25 No-Limit Hold'em (10 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Texas Grabem 1.7 by www.pokerstrategy.cc.

      Preflop: Hero is CO with A:spade: , A:diamond:
      UTG folds, UTG+1 calls $0,25, 4 folds, Hero raises to $1,25, 3 folds, UTG+1 calls $1,00.

      Flop: ($2,85) 6:spade: , Q:diamond: , 8:club: (2 players)
      UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $2, UTG+1 calls $2,00.

      Turn: ($6,85) J:club: (2 players)
      UTG+1 checks, Hero ???
  • 18 replies
    • undercover82
      undercover82
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.12.2006 Posts: 813
      I would bet again 5$ to avoid giving him a free card as the board starts getting drawy, and i would check behind on the river.
    • mcofko
      mcofko
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.04.2007 Posts: 12
      I would bet between 4-5$. He can't get a free card.
    • Gungunhana
      Gungunhana
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.02.2007 Posts: 429
      Don´t have any readings on him but his check/call from OOP, to me puts him on small pocket pair, AJ,AT,KQ
      I would make a PSB, to take the pot staright away and protect my hand, because I should probably be ahead.
      If he calls , I would check behind on the river
    • Timor83
      Timor83
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.06.2007 Posts: 2,793
      I would bet 4. The turn was a moderately bad card, so if he was calling before with 9T or QJ, he's ahead now. It's likely that only better hands will call you (unless he's really bad), and if he's on a draw, he's not getting the right price anyway. So by betting 4$ instead of 5, I'm losing not as much if I'm behind, and I'm inducing a mistake if I'm not. 5$ may be too scary to call, whereas 4 may not.
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      What hand UTG+1 can limp/call with. I´ll only do that with pocket pairs:P If I decide bet again on the turn then I have to fold to his re-raise. I voted check behind. That way he might bet river with weaker hands, which he would have folded on the turn and I don´t loose so much, if I´m against the set.
    • ciRith
      ciRith
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.03.2005 Posts: 18,556
      I just read yesterday something about a check behind on the turn on http://www.checkbehind.com from our german SnG coach to induce a bluff and loose less against big hands. (Pot control.)

      Like the topic says "small pots with small hands" I check behind because one pair is only a small hand in NL. Like other said he has a pocketpair most of the time which e would fold to our bet anyway and he doesn't have many outs against us.
    • undercover82
      undercover82
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.12.2006 Posts: 813
      Yeah , but :
      -it is still the highest pair possible.
      -have to make him pay for his draws
      -we could fold if he is passive and he checkraises us "out of our seat" :D
      -this line will usually provide a free showdown although it wont give him the chance to bluff.
      I am all for pot control (Turn is easily my lowest AF street) but in this spot i think its a bit weak to not bet again.
    • MisterB73
      MisterB73
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.08.2007 Posts: 32
      I'm with Timor83... I would only bet 4 because of his hand range. If he raises I'd fold and if he calls, I'd check behind on the river.
    • Timor83
      Timor83
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.06.2007 Posts: 2,793
      A check behind is not a good idea imo. One of the worst mistakes in poker is to give your opponent a free card that could beat you, which may very well be the case here, especially with the draw heavy board after the turn.
    • rubysilesia
      rubysilesia
      Silver
      Joined: 03.07.2007 Posts: 351
      I would bet 4. If he got TPGK he probably will call increasing value. On the river if he checks I would bet again less than 1/2 pot if the board is not very scary. If he bets high on the river I would fold.
    • sw0ldo
      sw0ldo
      Bronze
      Joined: 31.07.2007 Posts: 397
      Bet 5 then check behind
    • MisterB73
      MisterB73
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.08.2007 Posts: 32
      @Timor83
      I agree not to check behind on the turn. I was saying to check behind on the river. No free card there...
    • Timor83
      Timor83
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.06.2007 Posts: 2,793
      I know. I was responding to Cirith's post. A check behind on the river when a blank comes is doubtful either imo though, because at that point, I'm almost certain I have the best hand. Not many players would check on the river with something like a straight, a flush, 3oak or even 2 pair, especially when it becomes quite apparant you have an overpair to the board.
    • ciRith
      ciRith
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.03.2005 Posts: 18,556
      Lol I'm just a NL novice. Don't judge me too hard. ;)
    • Qastorimon
      Qastorimon
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.07.2007 Posts: 412
      I don't think that ciRith's remarks are that wrong. Of course you don't want to give your opponent a free card so he can hit his draw, but he already called us on a dry board on the flop. I don't think the chance that he's on a draw is that big. It's much more likely he holds TP, 2pair or a set. We could very well be way behind, giving him all the reasons to play his hand slow.
      We have an overpair, so we still can beat enough hands, but potcontrol should be important in this case.
      If we check he might bet out on the river, but to get some value out of a set he can't overbet the pot. In that case it won't cost us that much to call.
    • Puschkin81
      Puschkin81
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.04.2006 Posts: 4,786
      Sorry guys!

      Only 13% were correct here. The hand has been played the following way:

      Preflop: Hero is CO with A:spade: , A:diamond:
      UTG folds, UTG+1 calls $0,25, 4 folds, Hero raises to $1,25, 3 folds, UTG+1 calls $1,00.

      Flop: ($2,85) 6:spade: , Q:diamond: , 8:club: (2 players)
      UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $2, UTG+1 calls $2,00.

      Turn: ($6,85) J:club: (2 players)
      UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $4,75, UTG+1 raises to $9,50, Hero calls $4,75.

      River: ($25,85) Q:spade: (2 players)
      UTG+1 bets $5,47 (All-In), Hero calls $5,47.

      The problem is the bet on the turn. By betting we are committing ourselves to the pot with our overpair. Normally we scare away weaker hands and pay off stronger hands. If we would have checked behind on the turn we could have folded to a push on the river. As played we cannot fold the hand and have to call. Often you see 66 or 88 in these situations.
    • ciRith
      ciRith
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.03.2005 Posts: 18,556
      You should see my face now. :D

      It's like this smily: :D :D :D
    • Puschkin81
      Puschkin81
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.04.2006 Posts: 4,786
      FL fish :P :D