Late position marginal hands on micro limits

    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      So do you really open-raise small pockets and suited connectors from the cutoff and button positions? Because micro limit opponents are rather unpredictable I find myself in tough situations so often with these hands that I tend to think a call would be a better option? What do you think? Cbets as bluffs don't work that often on micro opponents.
  • 13 replies
    • Skyscrapers
      Skyscrapers
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.02.2010 Posts: 104
      if u have tight regulars to act behind u can profitably open late suited connectors, if there is like a 60vpip fish, obv no point in playin sc
    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      1) Micro limits tend to be full of rather loose opponents, so generally, unless I know the players behind me are tight, I mustn't open-raise, right? Obviosly, with small pocket pairs I should call then, I guess, but do I fold suited connectors, or can I call with them?

      2) Also, when facing unknown players on micro limits, do I really open-raise with face cards? Is it good to get called by a rather loose opponent with KTo for example?

      Thanks for your input!
    • Skyscrapers
      Skyscrapers
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.02.2010 Posts: 104
      Micro limits tend to be full of rather loose opponents, so generally, unless I know the players behind me are tight, I mustn't open-raise, right?


      wrong. you should open raise late, but you should adjust your range according to the players remaining to act after you. If they are generally tight you can open looser(include hands like suited connectors) , if they are loose you should open tighter. Use vpip and fold to steal stats on ur hud.

      2) KTo can be profitable to open form BU, but it is a marginal hand and this means you need experience to be able to play well with such hand. Don't expect to be winning right from the start with marginal hands. Just take your time to gain experience and avoid playing for full stacks with one pair when you hold marginal hands like KT, KJ, QT QJ AT JT and such. gl
    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      Let's say I raise with 33 from the button and get called. The flop shows 3 overcards, I know that most of the time a cbet won't work. I am left in a very unprofitable situation, don't you think? It's just that I seem to think that if my opponents are tight I can openraise from late position fairly often with any two hole cards, no reason to wait for those small pockets or suited connectors. A small pocket pair alone is not enough for a raise from the late position if I know I'll get called fairly often and won't be able to win the pot after cbeting the flop. It really is a matter of how good you are at reading your opponents, I think.. So I still am confused about the reason you have to be more prone to open-raise with small pockets or suited connectors rather than any two if you know your opponents will most likely fold either preflop or postflop.
    • Skyscrapers
      Skyscrapers
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.02.2010 Posts: 104
      1) if you think most of the times cbet wont work just limp-call preflop with 33 and try to hit a set on the flop.

      2)the reason why you should play suited connectors and not any two vs tight opponents (nits, tag-nits) is in their playback range. most of the times they will fold preflop, but when they call their range is usually: monsters, pocket pairs and marginal broadway cards(KQ, KJ, KT QJ ....) and since most of the times they will hold broadway cards you dont want to be playing some shit hands like K4, Q6 J7... because you will be probably dominated, and being dominated sucks and cost you alot of money.

      So suited connectors play very good vs nits playback range since they are not dominated by broadway cards, also they have good potential for making strong hands like straights and flushes and are generally easier to play postflop and more profitable than any two random cards.
    • degre
      degre
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.04.2009 Posts: 413
      Originally posted by Avatars91
      So do you really open-raise small pockets and suited connectors from the cutoff and button positions? Because micro limit opponents are rather unpredictable I find myself in tough situations so often with these hands that I tend to think a call would be a better option? What do you think? Cbets as bluffs don't work that often on micro opponents.
      I disagree.

      Playing NL10 on Everest and I do get lots of folding people. Actually I've got so many folding people that on average I bet on every pot regardless of my hand and position IF certain requirements are fulfilled:
      no more then 3 in the pot.
      flop isn't too drawy.
      opponent isn't a known maniac/calling station.

      And this second statement can be ignored depending on reads on player, if I know he's a folder I'll just bet against him with any hand on any texture.


      Just start getting notes on players, observe their plays and decide on that, you will notice that there are lots of limpers who hit nothing and are all too happy to fold and leave their money there for you.
    • Escobario
      Escobario
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.01.2009 Posts: 183
      whats a normal cbet success rate? 50%? 70%?
    • degre
      degre
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.04.2009 Posts: 413
      I'll say over 65/70%, but I'll double check the numbers.
    • ihufa
      ihufa
      Gold
      Joined: 18.03.2008 Posts: 3,323
      the worse the opponents the more hands you can play profitably in position, cbet/folding is not the only line you can take
    • SiXAT
      SiXAT
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.09.2008 Posts: 263
      THe micro limts usually contain loose or rock type players, and most of them are realy bad tight or loose.
      so i know that the loose player is calling my cbets very often and is very loose preflop so i can for exmple isolate with TQo for example, hit T and 3bet him till the river, unless he shows strengh or the board becomes scary. or if the board is like AT4, i check behind and if i get two checks from the loose fish i bet for value turn and river.
      and the rocks and tight players i attack more often with small bluffs.
    • gadget51
      gadget51
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2008 Posts: 5,622
      Without reads/stats I'll raise any broadways; PPs, atc suited and A7+ from BU all day until they tell me not to. If they start calling/reraising, obviously I tighten up my range a bit.
      Domination issues tend to crop up more with fish than TAGs, since the tag will call with small/mid PP, Axs and broadways. Very occasionally you can get caught out raising JQo, hitting Q high rainbow flop and the bb has KQ, but less often than if you raise them UTG say.
      Reads/stats are very useful in steal situations of course and I'm still a bit of a novice at that.
      And remember, you can outplay them by folding to.
    • degre
      degre
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.04.2009 Posts: 413
      After managing to find out the proper filter, works out that at NL10 my cbet success rate is 54%.

      I think that my perception was higher as I was thinking more of the 2/3 ways limped pot rather then pot raised pre-flop.

      If I find the proper filters I'll try to see the success rate on limped flop, anyway, a success rate over 50% indicates that cbet is profitable.
    • shotalick
      shotalick
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.12.2009 Posts: 3
      Hello guys. I play NL10 SH, multitabling. About that, raising pockets or suited connectors. I raise any pocekt pair from any position (first in), depends on players and their stats. If you hit set you will be paid. About cbeting those pockets, if some one call you.. You have to know when to cbet, if the flop is no straights or flushes. If you raise from early pos pocket 33, and hit set, you will be paid.

      correct me if im wrong.

      regards