Limits

    • Trbst
      Trbst
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.09.2007 Posts: 191
      Hi Guys ,

      I've a concern I wanna share.

      For some time now I've been playing on NL5 at FT. For all the time I spent there, I'm constantly loosing. Naturally maybe a little more than half of the losses are caused by me not being able to let go of a hand or whatever, but in the cases I do have a strong hand I get outplayed, suck out on, or outdrawn by other unbelievable players who call against their odds.

      Even though this may sound as something that many people have said before, I can't seem to be able to play a logical game on those limits. After making some research at PokerTableRatings I found out that the most winning players at those limits, play a lot tighter (10%-30% tighter) than an average player using the SHC in the bronze section per se, not to mention the other SHC's that are in the silver section.

      So my question to all of you playing microstakes is, to beat NL5 or NL10 is it profitable to play by those SHCs, or is it better to be close to Nit, and play 6-7 tables, thus win only from premium hands and rakeback ?

      Your thoughts are much appreciated because after some 50K hands on those micro-stakes I still get crushed like a bug.

      Thanks in advance.
  • 10 replies
    • FakeLunatic
      FakeLunatic
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.08.2009 Posts: 91
      It's profitable to play SHC's

      Did you read all articles in silver section? Stuff in those is more than enough to beat NL5

      Also, you could be just going through downswing
    • shotalick
      shotalick
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.12.2009 Posts: 3
      hmm.. i know how you feel. I play NL10 (sh) at pokerstars, previous i played at FT NL10 (sh). I have to say, on FULL TILT, as you say, i was sucked out in most of cases. As you say, people acctualy calling your bet on their odds (backdoor straights, flush draws, god shot and so on --> and they acctualy hit .
      Im playing now on pokerstars NL10 --> in 6 days i played about 10k hands.

      My statistic depends on 10k hand now is, VPIP 21 / RAISE 17. My showdown in quite big, but its because they bluffing me and i call them on second pair and so on. Try to play from late position, play pocket pairs first in from all position.
      Try to be aggresive, but still you have to know when to fold. Look up your previus game, and find mistakes in your play (maybe you doing something wrong). Make your session review, and watch some coaching an read the articles on pokerstrategy.

      regards
    • Trbst
      Trbst
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.09.2007 Posts: 191
      @ FakeLunatic : Yes I've read all the articles and I believe I've understood them all to quite good an extent. However, whether it's just downswing or not, it's unbelievable. I'm down 22 BIs on Full Tilt on NL5. I went to play on NL10 on Cake but it's more or less the same thing. There I'm actually down $120.

      I was told by a friend of mine, who checked some of my hands, that it's probably better to move up to NL25 because play makes more sense there and I might as well have better chances of winning rather than being called and sucked out on as much as on NL5/10. However, that sounds like a grave mistake - "Yeah move up the limits - those on NL5 can't be played against."


      The problem is though, that most winning players on NL5 are Nits, and being a nit is kinda stupid style to play....it's like..playing with SSS. No Point...
    • TheBu11d0g
      TheBu11d0g
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.07.2008 Posts: 2,019
      Hello Trbst,

      I wouldn't advise you to move up in stakes while you are still a losing player at the lower limits.

      I would suggest going over all your losing hands above a certain amount, and your winning hands to a certain extent as well, and make sure that you played those hands the best way that you could have. Maybe you will find a leak(s) in your play that is costing you money which you can eradicate.

      If you are not too sure about how a hand(s) were played then please feel free to post them in our hand evaluation section where you can receive expert advice from or Hand Judges as well as our more experienced members.

      You can also try watching our micro limit videos or maybe attend a coaching to see if you are making any mistakes that are also leading to lost money.

      Another recommendation i can suggest is to make a video of your play and post it on the forum in order to receive some feedback about your play. You could also arrange to have a sweat session with one of our members using skype and teamviewer/mikogo as well.

      I hope some of this information may be of use to you.

      Kind Regards,
      -Steve
    • Trbst
      Trbst
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.09.2007 Posts: 191
      Hi Steve,

      Frankly, what I need is for someone to review my whole database :) )

      The joke aside, thing is, yes I am checking my hands after the sessions, and I do identify some errors. Yet again, there are a lot of things that I can't really grasp, and even though I've evaluated my hands, a more experienced player would have x times more comments on the hand than me.

      That being said, I'd have to go with something a bit "tier-two" in regard to my coaching. I've seen most of the bronze videos already (also posted some hands or had them evaluated by friends). Yes there are many things I can extract from them (the videos), yet again, the effect is little.

      I'm really keen on that video thing though. Is there a thread where I can read what the video criteria is, how to make one, how long should it be etc ?

      Last thing, about that sweat sessions - can you give me more details as to what that exactly is ?

      Sincere thanks for your help man,


      Best regards,
      T.
    • TheBu11d0g
      TheBu11d0g
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.07.2008 Posts: 2,019
      Hey Trbst,

      The following sub-forum will be of help to you as you can post a video there as well as request a sweat session.

      I don't think that there are any articles as such showing how to make a video but a general length would be around 30-45 mins and there are plenty of free screen recording software out there. I personally use CamStudio for recording videos.

      A sweat session is where another member/person will watch you play for a given time via teamviewer/mikogo, which are screen sharing software, and skype, which is a instant messenger type of software, and they can comment on your play, you can ask questions about specific hands, situations etc.

      I hope this helps you out and if you have any further questions then please free to ask away.

      Kind Regards,
      -Steve
    • Trbst
      Trbst
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.09.2007 Posts: 191
      Steve,

      Thanks for all that - I'm definitely going for a video.

      I've got one last question though - who do I contact for more details on the sweat sessions ?

      Regards,
      T.
    • TheBu11d0g
      TheBu11d0g
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.07.2008 Posts: 2,019
      Hey Trbst,

      You can post a new thread in the link i gave you above requesting a sweat session.

      Just post what you're playing, the level and what you would like to gain from it.

      Kind Regards,
      -Steve
    • tokyoaces
      tokyoaces
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.04.2009 Posts: 1,883
      Originally posted by Trbst
      I was told by a friend of mine, who checked some of my hands, that it's probably better to move up to NL25 because play makes more sense there and I might as well have better chances of winning rather than being called and sucked out on as much as on NL5/10.
      Unfortunately this kind of thinking is riddled with logical fallacies. Once you are able to actually move up and beat NL5 and then NL10 and then NL25 you should drop back down to NL5 and play 1,000 hands or so. What you will find at that point is that you will be able to trivially beat NL5.

      If you still can't beat NL5 you really need to trust that it really is your lack of skill and not anything else. I went through the exact same thing trying repeatedly to move from limit to no-limit. There are definitely leaks in your game and you need to find and correct them where you can do so cheaply.
    • Trbst
      Trbst
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.09.2007 Posts: 191
      Thanks Tokyo, Steve.

      That's the exact reason why I wanted to ask for a few more points of view before following this advice. It does seem lame to think moving up will make it easier :D

      Oh well....the millions of dollars I was planning to win by my 23rd B-day will have to wait a bit longer :)


      Thanks again for the advices. I'm off to self-improvement.

      Good luck all.


      BR,
      T.