Solving a leak

    • goldi439
      goldi439
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.05.2009 Posts: 14
      Hey guys

      I have been playing NL10 and I noticed a leak in my game i think.

      As the PFR after making a 2/3 pot cBet in position I sometimes get min raised. This is the point where i think i should probably just fold, but i land up calling the min raise since the odds dictate a call. What do you think of calling in this position and what should consider before calling?

      After this would usually lands up happening is i miss the turn badly and land up checking at which point the villian ends up betting pot size and then i have to fold.

      I realise im doing something very wrong here but im not sure what please help.

      Also Im not sure how to import a hand into forum friendly format how do i do this?

      Thanks
  • 4 replies
    • noclaninator
      noclaninator
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.12.2008 Posts: 312
      Here are some scenarios

      You raise AK of hearts preflop to 0.30. BB calls. The flop comes Q :club: 8 :diamond: 3 :spade: . I would bet 0.30 since there are hardly any draws out there. Protection would not be necessary with a hand like KK since the most your opponent can really have against you is 5 outs. So you make that same bet with AK or AA KK. If he min raises you on this flop then you get 5 to 1 odds on a 9 to 1 shot (your 2 overcards). You need more than this. The only scare cards that can come down are the ones that help you so you fold it here.

      You raise A :diamond: Q :spade: preflop to 0.30 and sb calls. The flop comes JhTh7d. This flop is draw heavy so after sb checks to you you bet your 2/3 potsize which is the kind of bet you would make with AA KK or JJ in this situation so about 50 cents. He min raises you to $1. This min raise is a lot more telling. Does he have 98? Why didn't he protect against the hearts? Sets and two pair make no sense. This checkraise is a lot weaker. Furthermore on the draw heavy board a lot of turn cards will be scary. A heart and you can represent a flush. An ace or queen will give you top pair. A king will make you a straight. Here I would call and see what he does on the turn. You have more outs, and a good chance to steal some pots since you have position.

      You raise K :heart: K :club: to 0.30 and CO calls. The flop comes J :club: 5 :diamond: 2 :spade: . This is a dry board so you want to bet small. With 75 cents in the pot I might even underbet something like 35 cents. This is all you need to make them fold. They can't have more than 5 outs against you. Smaller bets = save money when you have the worst hand. Smaller bets also = curious people wanting to see the turn with random trash like QT. It is win-win. They min raise you to 70 cents. Now you call. Again, no more than 5 outs. You definitely can't reraise here. If he shoves you might have a tough decision. He might be an idiot overplaying top pair, else he has a set. On the other hand a call will allow him to continue his bluff if that is indeed what he has. No turn card can come save for the ace that will scare you. He might assume that you are weak since you only called his min raise. Then he bets $2 on the turn and you call that too and snap off this idiot's bluff or random top pair.

      On the dry flops I would play in a way that puts little money into the pot whether you hit or miss. On more draw heavy bluffs I would try floats and bluffing moves in position. There is nothing wrong with chasing overcards as long as there is something more than just overcards. Maybe a gutshot, backdoor draws, good bluffing cards, and of course position.
    • goldi439
      goldi439
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.05.2009 Posts: 14
      Hey noclaninator I appreciate the conclusive answer very insightful. Just some clarity needed on 1 issue.

      Originally posted by noclaninator
      Here are some scenarios

      You raise AK of hearts preflop to 0.30. BB calls. The flop comes Q :club: 8 :diamond: 3 :spade: . I would bet 0.30 since there are hardly any draws out there. Protection would not be necessary with a hand like KK since the most your opponent can really have against you is 5 outs. So you make that same bet with AK or AA KK. If he min raises you on this flop then you get 5 to 1 odds on a 9 to 1 shot (your 2 overcards). You need more than this. The only scare cards that can come down are the ones that help you so you fold it here.

      You raise A :diamond: Q :spade: preflop to 0.30 and sb calls. The flop comes JhTh7d. This flop is draw heavy so after sb checks to you you bet your 2/3 potsize which is the kind of bet you would make with AA KK or JJ in this situation so about 50 cents. He min raises you to $1. This min raise is a lot more telling. Does he have 98? Why didn't he protect against the hearts? Sets and two pair make no sense. This checkraise is a lot weaker. Furthermore on the draw heavy board a lot of turn cards will be scary. A heart and you can represent a flush. An ace or queen will give you top pair. A king will make you a straight. Here I would call and see what he does on the turn. You have more outs, and a good chance to steal some pots since you have position.

      You raise K :heart: K :club: to 0.30 and CO calls. The flop comes J :club: 5 :diamond: 2 :spade: . This is a dry board so you want to bet small. With 75 cents in the pot I might even underbet something like 35 cents. This is all you need to make them fold. They can't have more than 5 outs against you. Smaller bets = save money when you have the worst hand. Smaller bets also = curious people wanting to see the turn with random trash like QT. It is win-win. They min raise you to 70 cents. Now you call. Again, no more than 5 outs. You definitely can't reraise here. If he shoves you might have a tough decision. He might be an idiot overplaying top pair, else he has a set. On the other hand a call will allow him to continue his bluff if that is indeed what he has. No turn card can come save for the ace that will scare you. He might assume that you are weak since you only called his min raise. Then he bets $2 on the turn and you call that too and snap off this idiot's bluff or random top pair.

      On the dry flops I would play in a way that puts little money into the pot whether you hit or miss. On more draw heavy bluffs I would try floats and bluffing moves in position. There is nothing wrong with chasing overcards as long as there is something more than just overcards. Maybe a gutshot, backdoor draws, good bluffing cards, and of course position.
      Im not sure why sets an two pair would not fit into those betting patterns? especially because I tend to run into an inordinate amount of sets. Could you please expand on this. In addition could you please explain why a raise in that situation is weaker.

      Another thought playing at NL10, do you think the opponents really think through their plays at such a 'high' level? I have a hard time picturing most of these players even having heard of the concept of protecting against a flush draw, or am I very mistaken?

      Thanks in advance

      Another thought
    • noclaninator
      noclaninator
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.12.2008 Posts: 312
      Well I suppose on NL10 sets and two pair can fit into these betting patterns. You are right. Still, if they have two pair then calling on a gutshot to turn a straight has massive implied odds. You are calling 50 cents on a 1/11 shot to win a big pot. Calling should be correct here too.

      About the players playing on a "high" level; I would usually just assume that they play in a way that somewhat makes sense until they show me otherwise. If they are idiots then they will give you their money eventually anyways. If you focus on making plays that would be good against good players then you will beat everyone. If you make plays that are best against bad players then you just give money to good players. I'm not saying that NL10 is full of good players... because they are GOD AWFUL! but I still just assume that they don't completely suck.
    • dragonste
      dragonste
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.06.2010 Posts: 70
      thank you very much, i found all this extremely intresting an have found out were i have been going wrong aswel, thank you...