where i can find the range of things..

    • Skibula
      Skibula
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.07.2008 Posts: 86
      i mean,


      how much vpip consider loose player or tight

      how much pfr consider aggresive player

      what stats are really importent to notice them ?


      i know those stuff change case of the size of the table (cash or sng also)


      i play cash full ring cash
  • 11 replies
    • Hadi
      Hadi
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.08.2009 Posts: 12,303
      Hi skibula,

      maybe the Beginners section is not the right place for this - I've moved your thread to our General Poker Discussion :)

      Hadi
    • UeYa
      UeYa
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.09.2009 Posts: 96
      I'm not an expert but I'd say that:
      0-10% VPIP = rock
      10-20% = tight
      20-30% = loose
      30- 20101219212% = maniac

      Talking about aggression usually the ratio between VPIP/PFR should be close to 1.

      Example a VPIP 18% with PFR 15% is TAG, but a VPIP 15% with PFR 22% is way too aggressive, on the opposite hand a VPIP 15% with PFR 2% is a tight passive.

      Then on flop you should start considering CBet Flop/3bet/4bet percentages to give you a better idea on the player itself.

      My 2 cents (raise!!)
    • taavi1337
      taavi1337
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.05.2009 Posts: 2,920
      Originally posted by UeYa
      I'm not an expert but I'd say that:
      0-10% VPIP = rock
      those 0% VPIP guys are very profitable to play against, especially in HU SnGs

      Originally posted by UeYa

      Example a VPIP 18% with PFR 15% is TAG, but a VPIP 15% with PFR 22% is way too aggressive, on the opposite hand a VPIP 15% with PFR 2% is a tight passive.

      how can PFR be higher than VPIP? you're right, that is DAMN aggressive
    • Lizocain
      Lizocain
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.06.2009 Posts: 173
      how can PFR be higher than VPIP? you're right, that is DAMN aggressive
      That can be done only in one way, in live poker, when he says sitout and while he is going to the toilet he is shouting allin. that counts as PFR :D

      for full ring cash ur most important stats will be vpip pfr steal 3bet, fold bb to steal fold sb to steal, cbet flop, fold to cbet flop, I dont think anything more then this you will need, maybe 4bet % mostly if you have big stacks all around who are bluffing alot.

      against players with 10vpip or below, you can always call in position and they will most likely fold 99% of the time on the flop, they play raise/fold on flop with AK without hitting, or same way with any pair raise/fold, or limp/call/fold. when this kind of player continues you have to get out of the hand, exception lets say flop A89 and u have A9,sets (he gonna have AK almost always, at least) then u can continue, no point in slowplaying these ppl, you cant trick them, checking wont make them bluff.
      those have 30vpip+ and big pfr, you can almost always raise flop, check turn (with top pair at least) and they will raise any2 river so u call and note down what hands he played in what way. Aggresion factor stats might be useful for these players, flop and turn aggresion
    • Skibula
      Skibula
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.07.2008 Posts: 86
      thanks alot guys

      you helped me alot...

      thats what i needed :-)
    • taavi1337
      taavi1337
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.05.2009 Posts: 2,920
      you're welcome =)
    • roswellx
      roswellx
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.12.2008 Posts: 599
      hahahaha how can you have preflop raise (PFR) but not voluntarily put money in (VPIP) lol
    • UeYa
      UeYa
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.09.2009 Posts: 96
      Originally posted by roswellx
      hahahaha how can you have preflop raise (PFR) but not voluntarily put money in (VPIP) lol
      you can have it when u reply post early in the morning and the allin from toilet counts too :s_ugly:
    • sabo999
      sabo999
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.06.2008 Posts: 502
      (
      Originally posted by taavi1337
      Originally posted by UeYa
      I'm not an expert but I'd say that:
      0-10% VPIP = rock
      those 0% VPIP guys are very profitable to play against, especially in HU SnGs

      Originally posted by UeYa

      Example a VPIP 18% with PFR 15% is TAG, but a VPIP 15% with PFR 22% is way too aggressive, on the opposite hand a VPIP 15% with PFR 2% is a tight passive.

      how can PFR be higher than VPIP? you're right, that is DAMN aggressive
      :s_biggrin: ;(
    • Dvince900
      Dvince900
      Global
      Joined: 25.06.2010 Posts: 38
      Talking about aggression usually the ratio between VPIP/PFR should be close to 1. PFR be higher than VPIP?can be done only in one way, in live poker, when he says sitout and while he is going to the toilet he is shouting allin. that counts as PFR
    • alenstrat
      alenstrat
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.03.2009 Posts: 821
      I might not be correct in this, but I think you can't assign ranges soley using VPIP's. I personally think notes on players are very important. Ie which players are limping a lot Kx and Qx or only pocket pairs, or any two suited cards, etc.