To Shove, or Not To Shove?

    • BCShad0w
      BCShad0w
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.06.2010 Posts: 78
      Whats your opinion on shoving or not shoving with AA/KK/QQ/JJ... I've been seeing more people slow play and beaten, rather than shoving.

      I tend to shove AA-JJ and limp with anything lower... Even better if someone raises big before me, I'll happily shove.

      I'm still learning about when to shove, when to slow play and I do do both, but I tend to shove more. At micro, plenty of people will call you.

      /C
  • 2 replies
    • Styr
      Styr
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.03.2009 Posts: 410
      Are you talking about standard blind structures, or super/hyper turbo ones?

      Shoving aces or kings pre-flop first in is quite a leak in my opinion, unless you know there are some less evolved people acting behind who raise or go all in with any two cards. A standard 3-4 BB raise +1 BB for every limper is usually the best choice of action.

      In a super/hyper turbo however, limping AA and QQ is usually a good idea. Anything else is a shove or a fold, unless you know people who raise over any limper, in which case even AQ might be considered as a limping hand, in my opinion. Unless you want something more than a 60/40 flip.
    • albionpro
      albionpro
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.08.2010 Posts: 358
      Originally posted by BCShad0w
      Whats your opinion on shoving or not shoving with AA/KK/QQ/JJ... I've been seeing more people slow play and beaten, rather than shoving.

      I tend to shove AA-JJ and limp with anything lower... Even better if someone raises big before me, I'll happily shove.

      I'm still learning about when to shove, when to slow play and I do do both, but I tend to shove more. At micro, plenty of people will call you.

      /C
      your post is very general, like Styr said is it standard or turbo? I can only comment on standard because i dont play turbos.

      Now depending how deep stacked we are, what point in the SnG we are in and what action has occurred or likely to occur different situations can apply, some examples are;

      start of SnG upwards of 25BB deep, im standard raising 3x + 1BB for every limper like styr said. So no im not shoving here because who is going to call. unless you have an ATC image which is unlikely so early you wont get called so its pointless shoving. On another note i have seen people shove ATC in the very first hand of a SnG so a limp/minraise could induce a 3bet shove from a villain which is the perfect senario but this 99.9% of the time only occurs in the first hand when very deep.

      If you are ITM and still over 25BB deep then im not varying to much but you need to think about getting all the money in over the course of the hand so if your deep, you are not shoving but raising as usual and hoping it looks like a steal and then 4bet shoving if possible.

      When between 14BB and 24BB im likely to take up a similar strategy as above because your down to this point early in a SnG because you lost a hand early on, if that hand was played in a way which means your opponent will call wider then im raising bigger because most people at low limits should still call putting you on a similar range to the other hand. however, if you have showndown a good PF hand then im standard raising a different amount to what i raised before to give the impression i have a weaker hand. but still im never shoving here, unless its a 3bet/4bet shove.

      below 14BB i think its +ve to shove because your opponent will but you on a wide range because of your stack and is likely to call. Id rather get my money in and called or take down the blinds which will be a decent proportion of your stack. rather than limping someone raising then 3betting and then folding JJ and possible QQ. because your likely to be behind to villains 3bet range.

      Cliffs: only shoving less than 14BB but this is very dependant on the SnG and villains.

      PS: im new to SnGs and this is my view and should not be set in stone :f_biggrin: