[NL2-NL10] NL 10, AT bluff went too far

    • Pichux
      Pichux
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2009 Posts: 318
      ***** Hand History for Game 2435656022 ***** (IPoker)
      $10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Saturday, September 18, 02:15:14 ET 2010
      Table Cile (Real Money)
      Seat 1 is the button
      Seat 1: tangranstr ( $10.34 USD )
      Seat 3: SerialKillazz ( $13.32 USD )
      Seat 5: Piters1990 ( $12.72 USD )
      Seat 6: vokmal ( $10.09 USD )
      Seat 8: Goodman18 ( $7.74 USD )
      Seat 10: PoNFi23 ( $3.00 USD )
      SerialKillazz posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
      Piters1990 posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
      ** Dealing down cards **
      Dealt to Piters1990 [ A :heart: T :club: ]
      vokmal folds
      Goodman18 calls [$0.10 USD]
      tangranstr calls [$0.10 USD]
      SerialKillazz folds
      Piters1990 raises [$0.35 USD]
      Goodman18 calls [$0.35 USD]
      tangranstr folds
      ** Dealing Flop ** [ 6 :diamond: , K :club: , 5 :spade: ]
      Piters1990 bets [$0.52 USD]
      Goodman18 calls [$0.52 USD]
      ** Dealing Turn ** [ 9 :club: ]
      Piters1990 checks
      Goodman18 bets [$1.56 USD]
      Piters1990 raises [$3.40 USD]
      Goodman18 calls [$1.84 USD]
      ** Dealing River ** [ 2 :spade: ]
      Piters1990 checks
      Goodman18 checks

      Villain: 65/17/1.8 on 155h sample, with a fish tag.

      Just played it badly, was close to the end of my session and a bit tired. I think that normally giving up on the turn against such a bad player would be the best line here...
  • 4 replies
    • MaestroOfZerg
      MaestroOfZerg
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.11.2008 Posts: 5,510
      Hi,


      Agreed, tho I don't know why you even have the word "tag" in a post concerning a 65/17 guy :p


      Hope it helps.
    • yeahyoung0312
      yeahyoung0312
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.12.2009 Posts: 340
      Push river to complete the bluff IMO.

      The important thing is if villain had anything strong on the turn he would have gotten it in there. When he called your ch-raise turn you just have to jam any river.

      If you want to bluff it's usually a good idea to clear your clip instead of holding anything back. Here villain obviously had a KJ/KQ type of hand that is not too strong to go AI with but too good to fold. Push river will give him a hard time because your turn ch/raise shows enormonous strength and if he did not fold KJ/KQ to a push then he is really exploitable in the long run.

      Personally on NL10 I would even fold AK to a push there. You can argue that he's too bad to fold a KQ/KJ type of hand. But I think even bad players would re-evaluate there.

      BTW, if he's bad, why ch/raise bluff him to start with?
    • Pichux
      Pichux
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2009 Posts: 318
      Answering to the judges question - TAG is not meant tight-agressive here. It's meant that i tagged him as a fish in my HEM.

      To yeahyoung - I don't think there is any sense pushing the river here. He showed up with 89o here and after the turn he had about 1/3 potsize bet left. I think that with any K the fish is leading out here because they don't look at their kicker mos of the time. Plus it's a unwritten rule for me - "If you find yourself in a tough spot in a hand, in that you realise that you haven't been concentrating and played your A-game on the earlier streets, just fold." Even if i happen to lay down the best hand, which will occcur not very often i think, loosing the thought process on your decision making it turns just in a pure gambling. And we aren't gamblers, right? :s_cool:
    • yeahyoung0312
      yeahyoung0312
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.12.2009 Posts: 340
      Originally posted by Pichux
      To yeahyoung - I don't think there is any sense pushing the river here. He showed up with 89o here and after the turn he had about 1/3 potsize bet left. I think that with any K the fish is leading out here because they don't look at their kicker mos of the time.
      Again, he flat your turn check/raise which means he had a moderately strong hand. Therefore pushing any river makes perfect sense.

      You ch/raised turn already. So to complete your bluff you have to push river. By doing so you play the hand consistently. Most of the times you just have to clear your clip when you bluff. And (this is results oriented thinking) even a fish like this would fold 89o to a push with about $3 left in his stack.

      If you think villain had Kx you should still push there with plenty of fold equity. Even if you got called you show the rest of the table your aggressive image and next time if you have nuts on the river they will consider calling a push.

      Now you check river to show down with AT and observant players will note that you can check-raise bluff turn but give up on river so they can call turn with moderate holdings against you. They will also note if you push river it means nuts so they can find an easy fold.

      I believe all these have nothing to do with gambling. All we are talking about here is fold equity, representing a strong hand, reading your opponent, and table image.