Killer rake and low-rake poker rooms

    • fuzzyfish
      fuzzyfish
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.01.2010 Posts: 862
      I'm sure I'm not the first one to notice this but the rake in most major poker rooms is just insanely high, right? I grinded a month in Pokerstars NL10 tables, made around $200 and paid $400 in rake. Ok there's bonuses worth about 25%, but thats still like $300 paid just for the opportunity to play there. I mean, come on - I play MICROstakes, I have a bankroll of $300 and I pay $300 a month in service fees? I could lease a brand new car for that money. Where does that money go?

      Poker rooms make pretty decent profit. I understand that in free market economy competition is supposed to deal with such issues and push the service fees down. Somehow it doesn't and all major poker rooms charge about the same rake, making nice net profit in the progress... Whats up with that?

      Last but not least - I've found that there are several small poker rooms that offer far lower rake or far more generous rakeback than the big ones (Pay No Rake Poker and WSEX for example, I don't know if I'm allowed to post the brand names in this forum). Lets say you play at a small poker room offering 50% rakeback - that would be extra 100 bucks a month when we look at the the above NL10 example. Is it worth it? Has anybody had any experiences with that kind of poker rooms? Are they trustworthy? How about traffic and fishiness?

      Thanks for you're thoughts, everybody.
  • 13 replies
    • nibbana
      nibbana
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.12.2009 Posts: 1,186
      Originally posted by fuzzyfish
      How about traffic and fishiness?
      There's never going to be as much traffic as Full Tilt or PokerStars, though the games can be softer. Sometimes the software on smaller rooms can be really frustrating, laggy, inhibits your ability to multi table as effectively.

      Originally posted by fuzzyfish
      Are they trustworthy?
      This is really tough to assess until after something comes up. Though there doesn't need to be a superuser for the rooms to be considered untrustworthy - handling your data badly or bad encription is a big worry too.

      Originally posted by fuzzyfish
      Is it worth it?
      This is for you to decide !
    • prevolsek
      prevolsek
      Silver
      Joined: 18.02.2009 Posts: 283
      I'm also interested in depositing 500$ at pay no rake, so can someone with experiance please share it with us? Is it safe?
    • fuzzyfish
      fuzzyfish
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.01.2010 Posts: 862
      I just downloaded Paynorake and WSEX clients and I must say the traffic is terrible. There were like max 50 holdem players online. So I guess thats off for me. I wonder why people are not attracted by such generous rakeback deals... Needs more advertising?
    • conall88
      conall88
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2009 Posts: 1,715
      i bet they can afford to advertise with all the revenue they make on the site from rake.....oh wait...

      :D
    • Alficor1
      Alficor1
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.06.2010 Posts: 7,291
      What about CEREUS Network - UB.com and Absolute Poker? I personally play on AP and i really like the software. The traffic is decent, obv not as good as FTP or stars, but i cant really complain.
    • JuiceQuadre
      JuiceQuadre
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.10.2008 Posts: 2,688
      Originally posted by conall88
      i bet they can afford to advertise with all the revenue they make on the site from rake.....oh wait...

      :D
      I like.. :D


      Yea i personally never heard of those 2 sites... Maybe its just me but.. If there are sites with significantly lower rake and nobody is playing there.. then something is wrong..
    • fuzzyfish
      fuzzyfish
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.01.2010 Posts: 862
      Originally posted by conall88
      i bet they can afford to advertise with all the revenue they make on the site from rake.....oh wait...

      :D
      Ok so they don't have money to advertise because of the low rake, and that means they are bunch of losers... And sites which pwn their users with mega-rake and put the gained profit to advetising to pwn even more users with mega-rake are cool? Dont follow the logic here. How does that benefit us, the players?
    • opal99
      opal99
      Black
      Joined: 05.02.2008 Posts: 8,270
      Originally posted by fuzzyfish
      Originally posted by conall88
      i bet they can afford to advertise with all the revenue they make on the site from rake.....oh wait...

      :D
      Ok so they don't have money to advertise because of the low rake, and that means they are bunch of losers... And sites which pwn their users with mega-rake and put the gained profit to advetising to pwn even more users with mega-rake are cool? Dont follow the logic here. How does that benefit us, the players?
      logic: they make 1,3 billion usd per year from rake... are you sure you still dont see the 'cool' part?
    • Leito99
      Leito99
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.07.2009 Posts: 754
      i would play on small wesites (lets say average 150 players online)

      but i dnt actually know sites with small rake
      i thought smaller sites have bigger rake than usual
    • YourDoom
      YourDoom
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.08.2010 Posts: 878
      In fact this is important topic for me too.

      Playing SnGs now I need ROI +7.3% (rakeback included) to be break-even. Well its fishy enough BUT I am really afraid how it will look at higher limits where it will not be so fishy.

      I personaly dont like idea of playing when winnings:rake ratio is bellow 2, optimaly bellow 3. Paying for "fish supply" is ok, but not when You pay eg. 2/3 of winnings.
    • wasy8
      wasy8
      Black
      Joined: 29.01.2009 Posts: 1,507
      Originally posted by Alficor1
      What about CEREUS Network - UB.com and Absolute Poker? I personally play on AP and i really like the software. The traffic is decent, obv not as good as FTP or stars, but i cant really complain.
      yeah outside of the superusers and the consistent sketchiness at UB and AP, you can't go wrong :rolleyes:
    • Alficor1
      Alficor1
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.06.2010 Posts: 7,291
      Originally posted by wasy8
      Originally posted by Alficor1
      What about CEREUS Network - UB.com and Absolute Poker? I personally play on AP and i really like the software. The traffic is decent, obv not as good as FTP or stars, but i cant really complain.
      yeah outside of the superusers and the consistent sketchiness at UB and AP, you can't go wrong :rolleyes:
      I've been playing there for 3 months and i didnt meet a superuser yet. :D

      I'm not saying its better than FTP or stars, but i think it's worth giving it a try.;)
    • wasy8
      wasy8
      Black
      Joined: 29.01.2009 Posts: 1,507
      Its not just the superuser issue that happened in the past - its the constant shadiness shown throughout the existence of the cereus network and consistent security issues that the network is slow to react to.

      run a search through 2p2's internet poker forum for all the issues on cereus - simply put, your money may not be safe there, and regardless, why would you support a company that clearly has ethical issues?