"I always win over ????? hands."

    • Tiffy2
      Tiffy2
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.06.2010 Posts: 56
      Poker is a game of skill, with an element of luck.

      A skilled player will win in the long run.

      So, what is a long run ? For example, would a skilled player be able to say "My bankroll is always bigger after 1.000 hands".
  • 30 replies
    • NightFrostaSS
      NightFrostaSS
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.10.2008 Posts: 5,255
      Long run is.. too long. ;) As for being in profit, I'd say ~100k hands unless your edge is very small. 1k hands is like nothing at all.
    • MichaelM
      MichaelM
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.01.2007 Posts: 4,087
      Trust him, he's a diamond.

      I am far away from being a pro, but the key to become a successful player is to learn and improve your game constantly.
      Learn (by reading Articles, using the Handjudging board, watch Videos and join Coachings), Play and analyse - Start from the beginning.
    • Tiffy2
      Tiffy2
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.06.2010 Posts: 56
      Thanks for helping me to get a realistic view of these things.

      I'll get back to you when I have done 100.000 hands !
    • Snodreliss
      Snodreliss
      Silver
      Joined: 23.12.2007 Posts: 1,280
      And 100k hands downswing happens too..
    • NightFrostaSS
      NightFrostaSS
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.10.2008 Posts: 5,255
      Originally posted by Snodreliss
      And 100k hands downswing happens too..
      Ofc happens, but at SSNL+ where edges are smaller.
    • tcs35
      tcs35
      Bronze
      Joined: 31.01.2009 Posts: 3,583
      Originally posted by Snodreliss
      And 100k hands downswing happens too..
      If you have a really bad winrate and sd then yes, but if it happens then you are probably not a good enough poker player yet.
    • ihufa
      ihufa
      Gold
      Joined: 18.03.2008 Posts: 3,323
      yet!
    • welshblokee
      welshblokee
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.09.2010 Posts: 15
      This is my take on poker, and generally a realistic view...

      Players say that it is mostly skill with an element of luck yet they then go on to describe there current form as an "upturn good run" or a "badrun/ bad-swing"
      Surely the good runs are consistent with good luck and the bad runs are consistent with bad luck, (if their game is solid). There-fore in conclusion poker is basically all reliant on luck.. 2 solid players vs each other, the lucky player wins everytime....
      To get dealt the playable hands is reliant on luck, to not get outdrawn when the money goes in is also relaint on luck , albeit not getting bad luck...
      Any game which the outcome is dictated by a random event is purely LUCK....
      Online poker is even more-so reliant on luck, so dont fool yourself into thinking that poker is a sure way to make money, unless of course you are a lucky son of a xxxxx lol....
    • fuzzyfish
      fuzzyfish
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.01.2010 Posts: 862
      2 solid players vs each other, the lucky player wins everytime....
      Yes, and if two equally good football teams play a match, the lucky team wins every time. Therefore football is gambling.
    • wlcKeD
      wlcKeD
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.02.2009 Posts: 1,048

      Yes, and if two equally good football teams play a match, the lucky team wins every time. Therefore football is gambling.
      :f_thumbsup:
    • welshblokee
      welshblokee
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.09.2010 Posts: 15
      Very amusing, you my friend are in denial if that is the best analogy you can come up.... And if 2 football teams are EQUALLY MATCHED the outcome would be a draw you moron......it is the goals that seperate the teams, I can't believe you compare football to poker, hey I might put a bet on my local park side to win the F.A. cup as they might get lucky , right????
    • NightFrostaSS
      NightFrostaSS
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.10.2008 Posts: 5,255
      It would be insanely hard to find two equally skilled poker players and if that was the case sure, short term luck would determine the winner, in the long run both players would lose to rake and break even if there was no rake.

      And even if you'd find two equally skilled players, they are not forced to play against each other, determining in what games you will be able to show profit and playing in those games is part of being a good poker player. The only reason why two equally skilled players should play against each other is to improve and not make profit.

      As for comparing poker with sports, I'd say better analogy would be basketball, if free thrower that has an 80% accuracy misses five shots in a row it doesn't mean that basketball is all luck doesn't it? So why if your aces gets cracked five times in a row suddenly poker becomes all luck?

      Over meaningful enough sample both, free thrower will still have his 80% accuracy as well as aces will win preflop all in ~same % of the time.
    • Waiboy
      Waiboy
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.09.2008 Posts: 4,877
      Originally posted by NightFrostaSS
      It would be insanely hard to find two equally skilled poker players and if that was the case sure, short term luck would determine the winner, in the long run both players would lose to rake and break even if there was no rake.

      And even if you'd find two equally skilled players, they are not forced to play against each other, determining in what games you will be able to show profit and playing in those games is part of being a good poker player. The only reason why two equally skilled players should play against each other is to improve and not make profit.

      As for comparing poker with sports, I'd say better analogy would be basketball, if free thrower that has an 80% accuracy misses five shots in a row it doesn't mean that basketball is all luck doesn't it? So why if your aces gets cracked five times in a row suddenly poker becomes all luck?

      Over meaningful enough sample both, free thrower will still have his 80% accuracy as well as aces will win preflop all in ~same % of the time.
      first Solid post. :f_p:
    • fuzzyfish
      fuzzyfish
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.01.2010 Posts: 862
      And if 2 football teams are EQUALLY MATCHED the outcome would be a draw you moron......
      Ehm... so youre actually claiming that equal teams always tie the game and best team always wins? Oh boy...

      Whats you're IQ? Does youre doctor know about you playing poker? I dont think its ethical to allow this.
    • welshblokee
      welshblokee
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.09.2010 Posts: 15
      ok smartarse, if you believe that poker is mostly skill then why don't you get onto i network (betfred will hill etc) and take down the jackpot sit and goes, for a measly $50 buy in, 6 seater stt, you can take away $110,000 for winning 6 in a row. Actually why arent the best and most "skilled players" doing this on a regular basis", I'll tell you why, it is because of the random outcomes which we refer to as LUCK......you just keep that pipe dream alive kid....
    • welshblokee
      welshblokee
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.09.2010 Posts: 15
      And yes if the teams were equally matched THAT IS A DRAW, read and interpret the sentence pal....and you do have draws in poker, they are known as those things called mmmm let me think....split pots.....ffs it's like teaching a monkey....
      Chess is skill poker is luck....
      If you played a pro chess player 1000 times, you would lose 1000 times.
      If you played a pro poker player 1000 times, what do you think would be the outcome??? (heads up of course)
      bored now....
    • welshblokee
      welshblokee
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.09.2010 Posts: 15
      I'm not saying that poker is all luck, just a majority.
    • Adapter1337
      Adapter1337
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.01.2010 Posts: 734
      http://www.pokertableratings.com/fulltilt-player-search/durrrr
      http://www.pokertableratings.com/stars-player-search/nanonoko
      http://www.pokertableratings.com/fulltilt-player-search/jungleman12

      just some of the luckyest guys in the world :)
      They have ALL the time luck... no matter against who they are playing, they just keep winning, they get better cards than others for sure.....
      ....but if they are so fucking lucky, why they dont play bingo? Just buy 1 ticket and you can win 1milj, but no, they are playing some stiupid poker 10h/day... So lucky but no brains...
    • lennonac
      lennonac
      Global
      Joined: 02.05.2009 Posts: 1,421
      There is always one
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