[NL20-NL50] 5 Hands with crazy player(s).

    • Dublimax
      Dublimax
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.11.2008 Posts: 2,233
      Hi,

      I know posting 5 hands in the same thread isn't the best but to reflect the dynamic of the table I think it is important for these ones.
      When the guy on my left sat at the table I didn't have any stats on him. So I will keep updating his stats on each hand that I will put in a chronological order.

      #1

      iPoker - £0.50 NL - Holdem - 4 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      SB: £25.75 VP:37/PR:18 (163 h)
      BB: £40.00 VP:40/PR:12 (977h)
      Hero (UTG): £50.25
      BTN: £108.84 VP:71//PR:57/AFq:57 (7 Hands) That's the one! Already doubled up after 7 hands

      SB posts SB £0.25, BB posts BB £0.50

      Pre Flop: (£0.75) Hero has A:spade: K:diamond:

      Hero raises to £2.00, BTN raises to £3.50, SB calls £3.25, BB calls £3.00, Hero raises to £15.00, BTN calls £11.50, fold, fold

      Flop: (£37.00, 2 players) 5:spade: 7:club: 6:diamond:
      Hero checks, BTN bets £18.50, fold

      Having missed the flop I don't CBet, he can have any 2 pairs here that he will push with.


      #2 5 mins after

      iPoker - £0.50 NL - Holdem - 5 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      CO: £41.81 VP:74/PR:34 (47h)
      BTN: £35.75 VP:40/PR:12 (1k hands)
      SB: £61.63
      Hero (BB): £48.75
      UTG: £131.91 VP:50//PR:36/AFq:67 (14 hands)

      SB posts SB £0.25, Hero posts BB £0.50

      Pre Flop: (£0.75) Hero has Q:heart: A:heart:

      UTG raises to £1.50, CO calls £1.50, BTN calls £1.50, fold, Hero raises to £6.00, UTG calls £4.50, fold, BTN calls £4.50

      Flop: (£19.75, 3 players) 8:diamond: K:spade: K:heart:
      Hero checks, UTG bets £19.75, fold, fold

      Is the 3B good vs these 3 fishes?
      I think it is because if I get called (and I knew I would) I have the bet hand 90% of the time.
      Missing the flop I give up.
      The table was crazy so I was playing very abc trying to get value when I hit and let the hand go otherwise.


      #3 12 min after

      iPoker - £0.50 NL - Holdem - 5 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      BTN: £51.59
      SB: £13.75
      BB: £73.34
      Hero (UTG): £54.88
      CO: £224.60 VP:50/PR:27/AFq:68 (30h) he had 4.5Buyins at this time

      SB posts SB £0.25, BB posts BB £0.50

      Pre Flop: (£0.75) Hero has 6:diamond: 6:club:

      Hero raises to £2.00, CO calls £2.00, fold, fold, fold

      Flop: (£4.75, 2 players) Q:club: 4:diamond: 6:heart:
      Hero bets £2.50, CO calls £2.50

      Turn: (£9.75, 2 players) K:diamond:
      Hero bets £7.50, CO calls £7.50

      River: (£24.75, 2 players) 9:spade:
      Hero checks, CO bets £212.60, Hero calls £42.88

      I hit my set so I try to extract money (could have bet 4$ on the flop)
      I Check the river because I was sure that he would barrel it (he was so aggressive - AFq=68). So far in the previous hands basically he had barreled asa he could.
      He goes AI . ofc I'm beaten by QQ,KK,99 and JT but he can have anything really and I am inducing bluffs with my C so I think I have to call.


      #4 Following hand

      iPoker - £0.50 NL - Holdem - 5 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      CO: £51.04
      BTN: £12.75
      SB: £74.34
      Hero (BB): £50.00
      UTG: £276.98 VP:51//PR:26/AFq:62 (35 h)
      SB posts SB £0.25, Hero posts BB £0.50

      Pre Flop: (£0.75) Hero has K:club: A:heart:

      UTG calls £0.50, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to £2.00, UTG calls £1.50

      Flop: (£4.25, 2 players) T:club: 5:club: 9:heart:
      Hero bets £3.00, UTG calls £3.00

      Turn: (£10.25, 2 players) 7:club:
      Hero bets £7.00, UTG calls £7.00

      River: (£24.25, 2 players) Q:spade:
      Hero checks, UTG bets £12.12, fold

      This time I CBet.
      Turn: I CBet again because of the FD. Maybe I should have given up there.
      RIver I give up.

      #5 Following hand

      iPoker - £0.50 NL - Holdem - 5 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      UTG: £51.04 VP:25(EP:21)/PR:20(EP:21)/AFq:50/Fold 3B EP:67%
      CO: £12.75
      BTN: £74.09
      Hero (SB): £38.00
      BB: £288.02 VP:53/PR:25/AFq:59(36 h)

      Hero posts SB £0.25, BB posts BB £0.50

      Pre Flop: (£0.75) Hero has A:heart: T:heart:

      UTG raises to £1.50, fold, fold, Hero calls £1.25, BB calls £1.00

      Flop: (£4.50, 3 players) A:spade: 9:club: 8:heart:
      Hero checks, BB checks, UTG bets £3.00, Hero calls £3.00, BB calls £3.00

      Turn: (£13.50, 3 players) 3:diamond:
      Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks

      River: (£13.50, 3 players) 4:spade:
      Hero checks, BB bets £10.12, UTG calls £10.12, Hero calls £10.12

      I decided to play this one passively (maybe on tilt?)
      River call is silly imo. I'm beaten by UTG but I'm given 3 to 1 so I called hoping that UTG called light considering BB play is crazy.


      Feel free to comment these hands.
      I have to say that I felt good playing this (these) crazy guys with the following motto in head: VS Fish we want to play for value . Not FE. that JoaoMartins kindly reminded me yesterday.
      I was ok losing loads of money and I thought I wasn't tilting. In fact I feel like I was somehow in hand #4 (just give it up on the flop?)and #5 (passive line questionnable and silly river call).

      Looking forward to your comments guys!
  • 7 replies
    • Chenghao
      Chenghao
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.10.2009 Posts: 274
      you can probably note that when you check , he will bet.

      if you want to fit or fold , don't 3bet preflop and give up like this , its just throwing money away

      the villian probably has a plan , all they need to do so to call your PF bet / barrrels and bet when you check to take away the pot.


      the hands they have don't really tell much when they are like below 100 hands , the hands become more reliable the more hands played

      http://www.pokerstrategy.com/strategy/bss/1585/1/
      read up continuation bet for hands 1 2 , 4and think , according to what is written in the article , what should you do ?

      hand #3 you want to be playing for stacks , nothing too obvious that he can have on the flop to beat you beyond Set of Qs . Having played with you twice where you where the aggressor preflop , and never cbet postflop , now that you cbet , you probably hit something and its the top of your range. do note what does he c/c , c/c then overbets with , typically that line is taken by a flopping the nuts on a rainbow flop type.

      for hand #4 on the turn ,

      http://www.pokerstrategy.com/strategy/bss/1576/1/

      Continuing your plan after the flop: Telling your story
      what story did you tell on the flop ? what is your purpose of betting on preflop and cbetting the flop ?

      for hand #5 , at the river , when one guy bets and the other guy calls , you should give up your hand at this point , in most cases you need a much stronger hand to overcall.
    • Ribbo
      Ribbo
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.06.2010 Posts: 6,157
      Originally posted by Chenghao
      you can probably note that when you check , he will bet.
      And villain can probably note that when Hero checks, he has nothing. 3 betting twice in a row and then check folding both times after missing the flop can be exploited pretty hard.
    • Hajler
      Hajler
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.10.2008 Posts: 270
      Hello!

      I think you have the right idea in that you should just be isolating fish preflop and value betting all day long. Playing against guys like this is obviously extremely profitable, but you are also going to take the most bad beats and what not against them as well. The most important thing is to just keep your head clear and play your A game even if you get stacked in some retarded way. You seem to know all of this already, but it can be easy to forget when a fish is sitting with 300bb and winning every hand. :f_frown:

      The hand with the set especially is an easy bet bet bet spot I think, if you lose there it's just a cooler.

      I disagree with the above post in that I really don't think that you can just follow the articles word-for-word, especially against guys like this. You don't have to worry about selling a fish on your hand, because they aren't listening to you anyways. I'm not saying you should just be giving up on the flop if you miss, but you obviously have to make some adjustments.

      Anyways I wish you good luck. May your tables overflow with deep-stacked fish. :f_biggrin:
    • Dublimax
      Dublimax
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.11.2008 Posts: 2,233
      Originally posted by Chenghao

      http://www.pokerstrategy.com/strategy/bss/1585/1/
      read up continuation bet for hands 1 2 , 4and think , according to what is written in the article , what should you do ?
      I know the CBet concept and I have read this article.
      However I am facing maniac players on my table and here is what it is said on the article that you mentionned:

      "Continuation bets promise little success against loose aggressive opponents, as well. These opponents don't just take their weak hands and draws too far, they also bluff and semi-bluff with these hands. What may seem like a no brainer contibet can often lead to a raise. You should completely refrain from continuation bets and wait for strong made hands when facing one particular type of loose aggressive opponent: the maniac. "

      Originally posted by Chenghao
      hand #3
      hand #4
      for hand #5
      I would tend to agree with your comments there. Only if it was a normal table. I think that you missed somehow that I was playing very loose aggressive players. That's why I have adapted to this (or anyways tried to) and basically asking if I did well or not.
      But you've got to take this into account in your analysis.
    • Dublimax
      Dublimax
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.11.2008 Posts: 2,233
      Originally posted by Ribbo
      Originally posted by Chenghao
      you can probably note that when you check , he will bet.
      And villain can probably note that when Hero checks, he has nothing. 3 betting twice in a row and then check folding both times after missing the flop can be exploited pretty hard.
      True. But twice in a row doesnt mean always (see #4)
      btw you can see there that villain doesn't really care since he called me anyways when I am supposed to have a good hand (since when I have a weak hand I C/F and with good hand I CBet)
    • Dublimax
      Dublimax
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.11.2008 Posts: 2,233
      Originally posted by Hajler
      Hello!

      I think you have the right idea in that you should just be isolating fish preflop and value betting all day long. Playing against guys like this is obviously extremely profitable, but you are also going to take the most bad beats and what not against them as well. The most important thing is to just keep your head clear and play your A game even if you get stacked in some retarded way. You seem to know all of this already, but it can be easy to forget when a fish is sitting with 300bb and winning every hand. :f_frown:

      The hand with the set especially is an easy bet bet bet spot I think, if you lose there it's just a cooler.

      I disagree with the above post in that I really don't think that you can just follow the articles word-for-word, especially against guys like this. You don't have to worry about selling a fish on your hand, because they aren't listening to you anyways. I'm not saying you should just be giving up on the flop if you miss, but you obviously have to make some adjustments.

      Anyways I wish you good luck. May your tables overflow with deep-stacked fish. :f_biggrin:
      Only read this after answering to the other 2 ppl.
      +1

      Now the question is did I adapt well?
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      1) depends what is BU 3-bet range. I think very reasonable line is c/rai flop although board is quite coordinated, but also don´t think he is 3-betting you too often with 76s, rather smt like AQ/AJ,JT that you are ahead on that board
      2) 3-bet is fine
      I´d would still make c-bet on KK8 board since I think I often have best hand and if not I can shove any heart or c/c orc/rai with A or Q
      3) can´t really see how you could loose the hand, I guess he had there JT or if he had QQ/KK/99 then you again get valuebale read how he is playing.
      c/c river is fine, I think he is often bluffing if you check to him, also not bad plan to c/r flop or turn, since he seems to take stab every time you check to him. After loosing that hand I´d likely quit session, since just some day you can´t beat aggro fish, you get tilted and would just loose more money
      4) I think I would barrel river unless you have seen him calling down with 3rd pair. Since he had stacked you before don´t think he is making too light hero calls
      5) flop and turn is fine, but I´d made valuebet myself on the river rather than c/c. With Ats I would also likely call. You should be ahead there enough times