Interesting Issue

    • chenny8888
      chenny8888
      Silver
      Joined: 03.10.2007 Posts: 19,324
      I'm playing SnG and sometimes I get situations where my opponents will be collectively super-super-super-super-super-super-loose passive pre-flop. Such as they'll try limp with a hand and when I raise to 10xBB, they stay in (4+ to the flop in lots of situations).

      Now what sort of effect should this have on my play-style? I find this the most annoying style in the world to play against, and I'm really REALLY stumped as to what to do.

      This is because in the 1/3 times I actually DO hit the flop, I have NO idea whatsoever whether my TPTK is good or not, just because of the ridiculous ranges my opponents (collectively) could be on.

      I was thinking of tightening my range to JUST QQ+, but then I would get blinded out.


      obviously this playstyle from their point of view is retardedly -EV (singularly), but what can I do to beat an ENTIRE table doing it? I'm thinking perhaps put them AI before the flop, but again I'm very wary doing this as if I have more than 1 caller, my odds to win go right down with pretty much any cards..
  • 8 replies
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      make a bigger preflop raise. harrington says, that on a loose table, it can be 5,6 or even 7x the bb.
    • Puschkin81
      Puschkin81
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.04.2006 Posts: 4,786
      HI chenny8888!

      I agree with helemaalnicks. Just raise more. Even if 7BB are not enough: raise more. If they have this wide range, you always put money into the pot with a better hand. And that should be your goal.

      Good luck at the tables!
      Puschkin81
    • Mugge88
      Mugge88
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.10.2006 Posts: 510
      In the early levels of a SNG there are no shame in having a QQ+ range yourself, as long as you loosen up when the blinds gets bigger.. You don't wanna risk your whole stack with a medicore hand that early :)

      But as already mentioned: When you get a hand - raise it, and raise it alot! Make them pay for their mistakes..

      Good luck with it,
      Mugge
    • chenny8888
      chenny8888
      Silver
      Joined: 03.10.2007 Posts: 19,324
      Originally posted by Puschkin81
      HI chenny8888!

      I agree with helemaalnicks. Just raise more. Even if 7BB are not enough: raise more. If they have this wide range, you always put money into the pot with a better hand. And that should be your goal.

      Good luck at the tables!
      Puschkin81
      that's what i was thinking, but then if i do miss the flop and it's still a 3+-way pot, I'm in a lot of trouble.

      Might just combine the two.

      7xBB is not an issue for me, it's when I have to raise 20+xBB in a non-deep-stack tournament just to isolate (all too common :/)... that's when I get annoyed.


      Any thoughts about limping in with some otherwise raising hands to decrease "pot volatility"?
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      7xBB is not an issue for me, it's when I have to raise 20+xBB in a non-deep-stack tournament just to isolate (all too common :/)... that's when I get annoyed.


      The more you raise, the worse your opponents' call is. So if you do raise 20*bb, and you get called, well done. I normally pay for potcontrol with my strong aces (AK and AQ), so a small raise with those hands, or a call if someone has raised once already, is fine. But with QQ-AA you certainly want to raise.
    • chenny8888
      chenny8888
      Silver
      Joined: 03.10.2007 Posts: 19,324
      ofc, issue is when i'm holding those "potcontrol" hands. I'm just going to raise max 7xBB with these hands, then if they call and I don't hit, so be it.
    • Tigga
      Tigga
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.03.2005 Posts: 7,541
      that question is already answered. There is no problem in raisen up to 10x the BB. but then u have to look at ur stack. if u "just" have 15BB go pre flop all in even with 20xBB u can go all in pre flop against that lose opponent. ur opponents make mathematicaly mistakes by calling u. So its no problem to go all in with a bigger stack then 10xBB
    • ManniXXX
      ManniXXX
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.09.2007 Posts: 707
      Yep. I've noticed this on MTT sngs around middle blinds. I had an aboslutly crazy call vs my KK the other day. All in with 3 7 suited, which hit a flush on the flop would you believe.

      Meh, make a note and hope to meet him again because I'll gladly play that hand 100 times over with him again :)