NL10SH Challenge. 1.5months 100k hands!

the graphs and results don't really say anything yet imo. just keep grinding hard.

Originally posted by booomm
you have to keep a balance between your sb and bb 3bet too.

what do you mean?

Originally posted by Kruppe
the graphs and results don't really say anything yet imo. just keep grinding hard.

Originally posted by booomm
you have to keep a balance between your sb and bb 3bet too.

what do you mean?

I see lots of regs 3betting sthing ridicleous like 3 from sb and 13 on bb, that's very bad and highly exploitable imo, I like 3betting slightly wider from bb, but difference between sb and bb shouldn't be >1.5 imo.

right. well, problem there isn't primarily the balance, it's just that the player is 3betting an insanely low amount from SB

Originally posted by booomm

Originally posted by Kruppe
the graphs and results don't really say anything yet imo. just keep grinding hard.

Originally posted by booomm
you have to keep a balance between your sb and bb 3bet too.

what do you mean?

I see lots of regs 3betting sthing ridicleous like 3 from sb and 13 on bb, that's very bad and highly exploitable imo, I like 3betting slightly wider from bb, but difference between sb and bb shouldn't be >1.5 imo.

Are you that sick mtt reg on stars?

And normally SB 3b% > BB 3b%

Originally posted by Farmarchist

Originally posted by booomm

Originally posted by Kruppe
the graphs and results don't really say anything yet imo. just keep grinding hard.

Originally posted by booomm
you have to keep a balance between your sb and bb 3bet too.

what do you mean?

I see lots of regs 3betting sthing ridicleous like 3 from sb and 13 on bb, that's very bad and highly exploitable imo, I like 3betting slightly wider from bb, but difference between sb and bb shouldn't be >1.5 imo.

Are you that sick mtt reg on stars?

And normally SB 3b% > BB 3b%

not I'm not, will soon move to stars and hopefully I will be

Hej, I'm not particularly sure what to say about this discussion. Yes I'm aware my winrate on BB is bad and I'm also aware that you shouldn't have a huge gap between SB 3bet% and BB 3bet% in the way described. As mentioned I'm making some adjustments.

Not sure what else I can say without getting too tl-dr.

Quick Update:

I'm still alive, but I haven't been playing enough recently and am massively behind schedule. What I did do:

- 3 meals out in England before packing for a trip
- Early evening flight mid evening on Sunday 4th with the journey ending on Monday evening. (Long way, I got there on time)
- Free day on tuesday
- Long Ski-Day Yesterday, Left for the hill at 6am and got back (due to some unfortunate events with our car) at midnight.

Only just started playing again, Hopefully I can do some grinding up to schedule and get a graph posted in the next couple of days.

Edit: Oh and I feel like I've totally forgotten the adjustments I wanted to make on my play from the BB so I'll just do whatever I think is most +ev at any time even if it leads me to being retardedly unbalanced

If i've done my maths right i've been playing 3 weeks and should have made 42k hands. I've only played 20k so I'm t3h long way behind schedule. I did have a lot of days off and have been somewhat distracted by some success on my secondary site, but still, i'm failing pretty hard

i played 220 hands of zoom earlier in my challenge and although I learned to hate it a couple of summers ago i might play some more to get some hands in.

edit: Also decided to use profits from this challenge to get some coaching with obliooo, I want to set up some filters for spots where I should have defended vs a 3bet and where i should have defended my BB differently and discuss those hands.

Hand Time!

So note, I removed winnings and bb/100 from here so I just know my hands played and some other stats. Anyway I have a feeling I'm turning into a complete lagtard maniac, yet I think I'm still folding a shitton to anyone who notices and plays back even a little so that probably means really bad things for my red line. Things I'm probably going overboard on:

• Button stealing. I've been stealing 3/4 of the time!
• 3bet bluffing pre-flop especially in position vs EP opens
• 3-betting flops when I think villains look FOS
• Check/raising a ton of bad spots without enough barrel cards I can fire on
• My attempts to reduce my BB fold vs steal (now down to 61%) are putting me too far out of my comfort zone
• My BB 3bet range may be too polarised and not value heavy enough
• My cbet % is way higher than it ever used to be due to a constant search for thin value. Its 65%+ I think.
• Just being way too automated and barrel/fire happy. Perhaps not taking this seriously enough.

Overall, It feels like since my break in play where I flew to Chile my game has fallen apart somewhat and It is time for me to go into Equilab and draw myself up some new tighter ranges, aiming for 28/25 say, so that I can take advantage of my image. Anyway, I'll post some hands:

Maniac Moments

Hand 1: K7o vs 22/18 reg. BUvsCO

My motivation should be obvious, his range has limited high PP's left in it and mainly just Broadway bluffs in it knowing I 3bet BUvsCO a lot. Should be a tough call for an NL10 player.

I'm actually impressed by his taking this line with AQ, was expecting if I got called to see AK and less often TT, but I guess he must have noticed I was playing insanely.

Hand 2: 3bet pot Turn C/Jam vs unknown Fish.

Flop was going to be a C/F but I was lured in by the betsize. On turn the betsize seemed totally inconsistent given both our ranges are full of broadways and it seemed to me this was going to be highly likely to be a huge bluff as I never get to the turn with 9x in this way.

So I Fancy Play Syndromed myself and shoved only to see the flopped nuts. Only then did I recall I've seen these betsizing lines from fish before ♦

More Standard Marked Hands

Hand 1: Questionable 3betpot float

I had a vague intention of jamming river to fold out AK and maybe even JJ or something

Hand 2: 9hi river fold vs unknown fish!

Would have been nice to hit that double-gutshot. Villain paid me off a couple of times later on similarly pricing me into draws.

Hand 3: Over-adaptation to fish!

Villain was 74/9 on 43 hands. I figured I had an Ahi s00ted hand so I had to play his stronger range here and expect a nice pay-off!

Final Hand for the road: Bad Turnbet? How about a Check/Jam turn to fold out Kx, we have the Ad after all!

For anyone interested that final hand villain is 22/15 on 55 hands. Not sure what other stats will have come in by this point in the game.

Right, Hope everyone enjoyed those hands, (mainly the first two I expect) I'll race to 30k hands now and post a graph, I don't expect it to look good :f_love:

Cliff Notes:

1. Focusing a lot on my other site means I've played under 1/2 the hands required on this challenge!
2. I'm embarassed to post my graph because of my volume and I haven't even looked at it for over 10k hands now!
3. Trying to play even more LAG and exploitatively to maximise winrate has been severely hurting me. Spew and mucho bad play has happened!
4. I've read all the threads I can find and followed all the advice but I can't get HM1 HUD to read out stats for the current hand so the hands I've played there have all been readless, or rather, with me looking at the wrong players stats.
5. Following my new tighter range plan and not reading villains in such a detailed way is slowly reducing my spew but has not eliminated it completely.

When I dare to look at my graph I'll post it......

So after saying i didn't want to look at my graph i had a good day and want to look at the graph for it. Here it is. Enjoy ♠_biggrin::

Yes, I literally just filtered for today so I wouldn't have to look at my prior progress

[x] Confirmed good day!

Nice graph I would be interested to see your overall stats on the first graph you posted? I'm playing NL5 at the moment and it seems i can't win :-/ Good luck for the challenge anyway

I saw you were looking to discuss hands etc please PM me your skype so we can have a chat

Here you go:

Disclaimer: My game has changed a lot in that period however and various stats are entirely unrepresentative of how I play now.

Thanks for the support, I'll send you a community PM. edit: don't know how to use the community tool I've only sent you a friend request lol

P.s. Oh, Almost forgot, I've played 42k hands. 50k is approaching rapidly thanks to playing 3 tables of zoom with no HUD I might actually reach my volume target if I can keep this recent performance up!

Mine SB losses are 23, mine BB are 32 but I got form BU 53,3bb/100

HUD on zoom is a lot helpful to detect nit-limper's... They play around 28% hands and always are limping...

And to detect nits... Easy to avoid their strong ranges with dominated hands...

Originally posted by DjolusVicenus
Mine SB losses are 23, mine BB are 32 but I got form BU 53,3bb/100

I think you should be fairly happy so far with your play then. In general if you add SB and BB losses together and you get worse than -60 then you should start worrying. I'm still having a problem with my BB play but I think my SB losses might well be in the single figures now.

As far as your Button winrate, I don't know if 53 is sustainable, might well be at NL5 and 10 but its likely there is some run good in there too. I like to expect mid to upper 40's for my BU winrate, Its quite low on the sample I posted but my CO WR is actually out by a larger % to what I expect in comparison to the BU.

Originally posted by DjolusVicenus
HUD on zoom is a lot helpful to detect nit-limper's... They play around 28% hands and always are limping...

And to detect nits... Easy to avoid their strong ranges with dominated hands...

Yea, it would be really nice to have a working zoom HUD so I can see who folds vs steal too much but oh well, we'll see if my zoom rungood continues. Don't know what bb/100 I should expect from it as a game though.

Thanks for the stats I have accepted your invite on the community thingie and sent u a PM Check it ou Cya

Hello all, I think its time for an update.

I'm not happy at all with either my play or focus for this challenge and I'm going to put in some huge days to try and get close to my hand goal by next weekend so the quality is likely to slip further but who knows, maybe I'll wander into a huge heater somewhere on the way and stop playing my current brain-dead B or C auto-pilot game :f_love:

Oh, I do feel a little bit like I've run into a very large number of coolers but I couldn't possibly say whether this is actually the case or I have a selective memory over this sample.

Haven't checked my results yet and have a feeling I'm doing extremely badly. Mainly at zoom! I feel like I keep making slip-ups there with no HUD to give me even a bit of info on opponents. I think this is probably bringing up a lot of flaws in my game.

Speaking of flaws in my game, I think I've been making a huge number of small errors due to lack of focus. This Challenge has totally proved to me that having the potential to crush a limit over a decent sample and actually doing it are two completely different things! I think If I'd just played a simpler TAGnit style my results might have actually been better.

I'll paste some weaktight to a couple of zoom hands I played. Remember my HM1 is always 1 hand behind in zoom so I have no stats!:

Hand 1 These min3bets happen a lot at zoom and this time I wondered if villain might have misclicked pre so I called to check/raise some flops when I hit backdoors. He snapcalled and I gave up.

Hand 2 Villain seems fishy. I decided before betting flop he was probably not shoving many draws except KJcc and perhaps KTcc so when he jammed I instantly thought "fu AQ luckbox" and folded

Hand 3 Light 3bet preflop followed by bluffcatch line on turn/river. Thought of folding river to the betsize because it looks a lot like value to me, would have been happier if he'd shoved.

Hand 4 I actually think this river would be a cool spot for villain to shove with AcQx or AcJx if he has it, but I doubt any NL10 regs are doing it.

Now I've got some volume in thanks to zoom I might try putting in a ton more hands on the normal tables simply because I'll naturally get a better winrate there and I'm less likely to be such a spewmonster The month ends in a few days so my Challenge is drawing to a close!

Originally posted by DaPhunk
Haven't checked my results yet and have a feeling I'm doing extremely badly. Mainly at zoom! I feel like I keep making slip-ups there with no HUD to give me even a bit of info on opponents. I think this is probably bringing up a lot of flaws in my game.

Speaking of flaws in my game, I think I've been making a huge number of small errors due to lack of focus. This Challenge has totally proved to me that having the potential to crush a limit over a decent sample and actually doing it are two completely different things! I think If I'd just played a simpler TAGnit style my results might have actually been better.

I'll paste some weaktight to a couple of zoom hands I played. Remember my HM1 is always 1 hand behind in zoom so I have no stats!:

Hand 1 These min3bets happen a lot at zoom and this time I wondered if villain might have misclicked pre so I called to check/raise some flops when I hit backdoors. He snapcalled and I gave up.

Hand 2 Villain seems fishy. I decided before betting flop he was probably not shoving many draws except KJcc and perhaps KTcc so when he jammed I instantly thought "fu AQ luckbox" and folded

Hand 3 Light 3bet preflop followed by bluffcatch line on turn/river. Thought of folding river to the betsize because it looks a lot like value to me, would have been happier if he'd shoved.

Hand 4 I actually think this river would be a cool spot for villain to shove with AcQx or AcJx if he has it, but I doubt any NL10 regs are doing it.

Now I've got some volume in thanks to zoom I might try putting in a ton more hands on the normal tables simply because I'll naturally get a better winrate there and I'm less likely to be such a spewmonster The month ends in a few days so my Challenge is drawing to a close!

hand 1, meh... I prefer c/c and c/r the turn if you hit your BD or if your hand improve to a gutshot or something.

hand 2 I would definitely call the shove. hands like AJ, AT, are still in a fish range, and as you said a few draws but also some bluffs. I think you have enough equity to call.

hand 3: meh, but it shows perfectly the advantage of position. You do not have stats but do you take notes on villain calling A8o in 3bet pots?.

hand 4, I soooo call vs unknown; you are not that deep. I haz a flush! I call

Why don't you invest in a decent HUD and increase your WR?