In a way, all forms of gambling are the same - sometimes you will win and sometimes you will lose, it is just a matter of luck and in the long run the only winner is the guy who has figured out the mathematics and plays with the odds in his favour. Usually that guy is the casino or bookkeeper, but in the case of poker it is the superior player. When we play poker we are taking the role of the casino - we play with the odds in our favour knowing we will eventually come out ahead of the player who is hoping to get lucky. When you play blackjack it is the other way around, you are playing against the guy who has the odds in his favour and sure as shit he is going to win more from you in the long run than you will win from him.
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Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by TheBrood
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
You are obviously a sarcastic little jerk , I however have the hand histories to support what I say. And in fact I do make way more money at black jack
than poker . And besides I have won a few tournies and cashed many times , this however does'nt alter the fact that poker is heavily dependant on luck , keeping in mind tha luck comes in many forms. Skill and study only helps one upto a point.The only reason I play poker is because I enjoy tournies , its as simple as that.Easy solution.
Play BJ.People like you put me on life time tilt.
Nothing against new players and them trying to learn the game.. but ffs.. I hate stuff like what you wrote.
Play me HU right now... I show you luck... grrr...
Aren't you supposed to like... not tilt when you play HU?
I cant imagine why , whether you hate what I wrote or not does'nt alter the facts as evident in my handhistories and like I said I generaly play as close as I can to the book , I dont like those facts either but they exist and I can prove it with my hand histories
You sound to me like you were born on tilt and want blame somebody else for your sad situation
I am on tilt 24/7!!!!!
Everyone knows that.....
Now play me sir!! Play me!!! 
Nah but seriously...
Dude.. just quit then alrighty?
If ya can't beat the game and don't understand why you don't beat it hence blaming it on luck (this is approximately the same when golfers blame aliens that their shot curved) stop playing it.
Poker is a lot of fun... but stuff like this:
$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.com
Stacks:
UTG laguite34 ($12.49)
CO LepariaONE ($39.64)
BTN Hero ($49.25)
SB Ifootball ($48.75)
BB xmarsholdem ($30.99)
Pre-flop: ($0.75, 5 players) Hero is BTN T♣ T♥
laguite34 calls $0.50, LepariaONE raises to $1.75, Hero raises to $6, Ifootball calls $5.75, 1 fold, laguite34 folds, LepariaONE calls $4.25
Flop: 4♠ 2♣ T♦ ($19, 3 players)
Ifootball checks, LepariaONE bets $15, Hero calls $15, Ifootball folds
Turn: 9♣ ($49, 2 players)
LepariaONE bets $18.64, Hero calls $18.64
River: J♠ ($86.28, 2 players)
Final Pot: $86.28
LepariaONE shows: J♣ J♦
Hero shows: T♣ T♥
LepariaONE wins $84.78 ( won +$45.14 )
Ifootball lost -$6
laguite34 lost -$0.50
Hero lost -$39.64
always happens from time to time.
I had 2-3 hands like that one today.
I am still up in 971 hands while being 105$ under expectation.
So common.... I have been unlucky today, cards were against me. Lucky rivers for villains. How can I still be winning if its all luck? Don't you think I, and so many other players on this site, do something *cough* skill *cough* to make them win and make those bad beats over a big sample size insignificant to our overall money flow?
winning players can never be above expectation in the long run, they will always be under expectation by a fair bit
Originally posted by shortfuse
winning players can never be above expectation in the long run, they will always be under expectation by a fair bit
Any reason why that should be so ??
Originally posted by shortfuse
winning players can never be above expectation in the long run, they will always be under expectation by a fair bit
wow, so you expect to win less than you are expected to win?
you must have some kind of divine cognitive powers that let you defeat contradictions
Now that the banner/name of this forum/thread has achieved what I hoped it would do let explain what I meant by CON
I did not mean CON as in convict or confidence trickster but as in The pro's and con's of something i.e. the merits or demerits of something.
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by TheBrood
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
You are obviously a sarcastic little jerk , I however have the hand histories to support what I say. And in fact I do make way more money at black jack
than poker . And besides I have won a few tournies and cashed many times , this however does'nt alter the fact that poker is heavily dependant on luck , keeping in mind tha luck comes in many forms. Skill and study only helps one upto a point.The only reason I play poker is because I enjoy tournies , its as simple as that.Easy solution.
Play BJ.People like you put me on life time tilt.
You are 100% right G1
Nothing against new players and them trying to learn the game.. but ffs.. I hate stuff like what you wrote.
Play me HU right now... I show you luck... grrr...
Aren't you supposed to like... not tilt when you play HU?
I cant imagine why , whether you hate what I wrote or not does'nt alter the facts as evident in my handhistories and like I said I generaly play as close as I can to the book , I dont like those facts either but they exist and I can prove it with my hand histories
You sound to me like you were born on tilt and want blame somebody else for your sad situation
I am on tilt 24/7!!!!!
Everyone knows that.....Now play me sir!! Play me!!!
Nah but seriously...
Dude.. just quit then alrighty?
If ya can't beat the game and don't understand why you don't beat it hence blaming it on luck (this is approximately the same when golfers blame aliens that their shot curved) stop playing it.Poker is a lot of fun... but stuff like this:
$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.comStacks:
UTG laguite34 ($12.49)
CO LepariaONE ($39.64)
BTN Hero ($49.25)
SB Ifootball ($48.75)
BB xmarsholdem ($30.99)Pre-flop: ($0.75, 5 players) Hero is BTN T♣ T♥
laguite34 calls $0.50, LepariaONE raises to $1.75, Hero raises to $6, Ifootball calls $5.75, 1 fold, laguite34 folds, LepariaONE calls $4.25Flop: 4♠ 2♣ T♦ ($19, 3 players)
Ifootball checks, LepariaONE bets $15, Hero calls $15, Ifootball foldsTurn: 9♣ ($49, 2 players)
LepariaONE bets $18.64, Hero calls $18.64River: J♠ ($86.28, 2 players)
Final Pot: $86.28
LepariaONE shows: J♣ J♦
Hero shows: T♣ T♥LepariaONE wins $84.78 ( won +$45.14 )
Ifootball lost -$6
laguite34 lost -$0.50
Hero lost -$39.64always happens from time to time.
I had 2-3 hands like that one today.
I am still up in 971 hands while being 105$ under expectation.
So common.... I have been unlucky today, cards were against me. Lucky rivers for villains. How can I still be winning if its all luck? Don't you think I, and so many other players on this site, do something *cough* skill *cough* to make them win and make those bad beats over a big sample size insignificant to our overall money flow?
Originally posted by tmannie
I did not mean CON as in convict or confidence trickster but as in The pro's and con's of something i.e. the merits or demerits of something.
obviously.
I am not saying that poker is all luck merely that there is a lot more luck involved than people care to admit, which they often mask by using jargon, calling it all sorts of other things . I prefer to call a spade a spade (by spade I mean shovel) not the racially insulting version therof.
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by TheBrood
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
You are obviously a sarcastic little jerk , I however have the hand histories to support what I say. And in fact I do make way more money at black jack
than poker . And besides I have won a few tournies and cashed many times , this however does'nt alter the fact that poker is heavily dependant on luck , keeping in mind tha luck comes in many forms. Skill and study only helps one upto a point.The only reason I play poker is because I enjoy tournies , its as simple as that.Easy solution.
Play BJ.People like you put me on life time tilt.
You are 100% right G1
Nothing against new players and them trying to learn the game.. but ffs.. I hate stuff like what you wrote.
Play me HU right now... I show you luck... grrr...
Aren't you supposed to like... not tilt when you play HU?
I cant imagine why , whether you hate what I wrote or not does'nt alter the facts as evident in my handhistories and like I said I generaly play as close as I can to the book , I dont like those facts either but they exist and I can prove it with my hand histories
You sound to me like you were born on tilt and want blame somebody else for your sad situation
I am on tilt 24/7!!!!!
Everyone knows that.....Now play me sir!! Play me!!!
Nah but seriously...
Dude.. just quit then alrighty?
If ya can't beat the game and don't understand why you don't beat it hence blaming it on luck (this is approximately the same when golfers blame aliens that their shot curved) stop playing it.Poker is a lot of fun... but stuff like this:
$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.comStacks:
UTG laguite34 ($12.49)
CO LepariaONE ($39.64)
BTN Hero ($49.25)
SB Ifootball ($48.75)
BB xmarsholdem ($30.99)Pre-flop: ($0.75, 5 players) Hero is BTN T♣ T♥
laguite34 calls $0.50, LepariaONE raises to $1.75, Hero raises to $6, Ifootball calls $5.75, 1 fold, laguite34 folds, LepariaONE calls $4.25Flop: 4♠ 2♣ T♦ ($19, 3 players)
Ifootball checks, LepariaONE bets $15, Hero calls $15, Ifootball foldsTurn: 9♣ ($49, 2 players)
LepariaONE bets $18.64, Hero calls $18.64River: J♠ ($86.28, 2 players)
Final Pot: $86.28
LepariaONE shows: J♣ J♦
Hero shows: T♣ T♥LepariaONE wins $84.78 ( won +$45.14 )
Ifootball lost -$6
laguite34 lost -$0.50
Hero lost -$39.64always happens from time to time.
I had 2-3 hands like that one today.
I am still up in 971 hands while being 105$ under expectation.
So common.... I have been unlucky today, cards were against me. Lucky rivers for villains. How can I still be winning if its all luck? Don't you think I, and so many other players on this site, do something *cough* skill *cough* to make them win and make those bad beats over a big sample size insignificant to our overall money flow?
What is the purpose of this post? This thread makes my head hurt.
Originally posted by MikeyH
What is the purpose of this post?
What is the purpose of this thread?
Originally posted by Faye6891
Originally posted by MikeyH
What is the purpose of this post?What is the purpose of this thread?
I do agree, I don't get where is this heading to
And by the way, Dragar... it was not bad luck the hand you posted. Unfortunately you played it badly. After you re-raised there were still two players and you played with only TT preflop. If laguite34 had made a 4-bet I think you would have called or gone All-in with one player left to act.
And what you built was a big pot with your re-raise of 12 BBs
LepariaONE played accordingly an over pair, for him, you were a calling station
Originally posted by p0kerdragon1
Originally posted by Faye6891
Originally posted by MikeyH
What is the purpose of this post?What is the purpose of this thread?
I do agree, I don't get where is this heading to
And by the way, Dragar... it was not bad luck the hand you posted. Unfortunately you played it badly. After you re-raised there were still two players and you played with only TT preflop. If Ifootball had made a 3-bet I think you would have called or gone All-in with one player left to act.
And what you built was a big pot with your re-raise of 12 BBs
LepariaONE played accordingly an over pair, for him, you were a calling station
Well you cant say it wasnt badluck, of course it was =)..
and it was played well postflop i would say ..
Im not really SH guys so i dont know about preflop situation, but i know Ifootball couldnt make a 3bet, since hero did 3bet ^^
And if Ifootball 4bet, then hero is last to act actually, nobody is left to act behind him..
Well no ofense, i just dont really get what you were trying to say 
Originally posted by JuiceQuadre
Well no ofense, i just dont really get what you were trying to sayThanks for the review, I've already edited it.
I wonder how would Dragar played if instead of Preflop a X X T was a X X J and on River was T against the same player, what would be the size of your bet? (if you bet)
Regarding the hand. I don't think it was played badly.
In poker there isn't just one right way to play a hand. He could've just flat-called PF or 3-bet like he did. It depends on a lot of factors like position, stack sizes, opponnents tendencies, your own table image, etc...
CO usually has a wide range for raising here and I like to maintain an aggressive image at the table, so I personally tend to 3-bet in this spot. If UTG comes back over the top and CO folds, given the odds I'm calling, probably vs. a big hand. But most of the time he's just limping with weak hands and I'll consider it dead money. If he's got a big hand this time, oh well, no problem... you can always suck out vs. AA, after all, it's all pure luck. 
If I know that CO is a nit, then I might consider flat calling and taking a flop IP. But even if CO is not a nit, there's nothing wrong in just flat calling either, it will just require better decision-making skills post-flop.
In this scenario, I can't think of a best way to play post-flop.
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by TheBrood
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
You are obviously a sarcastic little jerk , I however have the hand histories to support what I say. And in fact I do make way more money at black jack
than poker . And besides I have won a few tournies and cashed many times , this however does'nt alter the fact that poker is heavily dependant on luck , keeping in mind tha luck comes in many forms. Skill and study only helps one upto a point.The only reason I play poker is because I enjoy tournies , its as simple as that.Easy solution.
Play BJ.People like you put me on life time tilt.
You are 100% right G1
Nothing against new players and them trying to learn the game.. but ffs.. I hate stuff like what you wrote.
Play me HU right now... I show you luck... grrr...
Aren't you supposed to like... not tilt when you play HU?
I cant imagine why , whether you hate what I wrote or not does'nt alter the facts as evident in my handhistories and like I said I generaly play as close as I can to the book , I dont like those facts either but they exist and I can prove it with my hand histories
You sound to me like you were born on tilt and want blame somebody else for your sad situation
I am on tilt 24/7!!!!!
Everyone knows that.....Now play me sir!! Play me!!!
Nah but seriously...
Dude.. just quit then alrighty?
If ya can't beat the game and don't understand why you don't beat it hence blaming it on luck (this is approximately the same when golfers blame aliens that their shot curved) stop playing it.Poker is a lot of fun... but stuff like this:
$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.comStacks:
UTG laguite34 ($12.49)
CO LepariaONE ($39.64)
BTN Hero ($49.25)
SB Ifootball ($48.75)
BB xmarsholdem ($30.99)Pre-flop: ($0.75, 5 players) Hero is BTN T♣ T♥
laguite34 calls $0.50, LepariaONE raises to $1.75, Hero raises to $6, Ifootball calls $5.75, 1 fold, laguite34 folds, LepariaONE calls $4.25Flop: 4♠ 2♣ T♦ ($19, 3 players)
Ifootball checks, LepariaONE bets $15, Hero calls $15, Ifootball foldsTurn: 9♣ ($49, 2 players)
LepariaONE bets $18.64, Hero calls $18.64River: J♠ ($86.28, 2 players)
Final Pot: $86.28
LepariaONE shows: J♣ J♦
Hero shows: T♣ T♥LepariaONE wins $84.78 ( won +$45.14 )
Ifootball lost -$6
laguite34 lost -$0.50
Hero lost -$39.64always happens from time to time.
I had 2-3 hands like that one today.
I am still up in 971 hands while being 105$ under expectation.
So common.... I have been unlucky today, cards were against me. Lucky rivers for villains. How can I still be winning if its all luck? Don't you think I, and so many other players on this site, do something *cough* skill *cough* to make them win and make those bad beats over a big sample size insignificant to our overall money flow?
Hey Waiboy, you created a monster by teaching him to quote ♦
Ok seriously tmannie, poker does have a lot of luck in the short term. Take the turbo tournies on Pokerstars. The blinds go up every 5 minutes and you start with 1500 chips. Very quickly you get to push/fold stage and then you could be out within one hand. You might think it is all luck and no skill.
But by playing according to a strategy and having experience you could have an small edge over your opponents. In the long run this means mega $$$. Just search the forum for a fella named Boku87.
Look at his graphs and note the number of tournies he had to play. He basically only made $1.5 per tourney, but in 14 days he made $10k. That is were true skill shows.
Playing BJ you are basically setup to lose money. I'm sure in a few games you might show a nice profit, but if you play 7000 games I'm sure that you won't be winner.
I would read the articles, play some hands and revisit the articles again. You'll understand it better then.
Cheers
Termi8r
Originally posted by Termi8r
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by TheBrood
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
You are obviously a sarcastic little jerk , I however have the hand histories to support what I say. And in fact I do make way more money at black jack
than poker . And besides I have won a few tournies and cashed many times , this however does'nt alter the fact that poker is heavily dependant on luck , keeping in mind tha luck comes in many forms. Skill and study only helps one upto a point.The only reason I play poker is because I enjoy tournies , its as simple as that.Easy solution.
Play BJ.People like you put me on life time tilt.
You are 100% right G1
Nothing against new players and them trying to learn the game.. but ffs.. I hate stuff like what you wrote.
Play me HU right now... I show you luck... grrr...
Aren't you supposed to like... not tilt when you play HU?
I cant imagine why , whether you hate what I wrote or not does'nt alter the facts as evident in my handhistories and like I said I generaly play as close as I can to the book , I dont like those facts either but they exist and I can prove it with my hand histories
You sound to me like you were born on tilt and want blame somebody else for your sad situation
I am on tilt 24/7!!!!!
Everyone knows that.....Now play me sir!! Play me!!!
Nah but seriously...
Dude.. just quit then alrighty?
If ya can't beat the game and don't understand why you don't beat it hence blaming it on luck (this is approximately the same when golfers blame aliens that their shot curved) stop playing it.Poker is a lot of fun... but stuff like this:
$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.comStacks:
UTG laguite34 ($12.49)
CO LepariaONE ($39.64)
BTN Hero ($49.25)
SB Ifootball ($48.75)
BB xmarsholdem ($30.99)Pre-flop: ($0.75, 5 players) Hero is BTN T♣ T♥
laguite34 calls $0.50, LepariaONE raises to $1.75, Hero raises to $6, Ifootball calls $5.75, 1 fold, laguite34 folds, LepariaONE calls $4.25Flop: 4♠ 2♣ T♦ ($19, 3 players)
Ifootball checks, LepariaONE bets $15, Hero calls $15, Ifootball foldsTurn: 9♣ ($49, 2 players)
LepariaONE bets $18.64, Hero calls $18.64River: J♠ ($86.28, 2 players)
Final Pot: $86.28
LepariaONE shows: J♣ J♦
Hero shows: T♣ T♥LepariaONE wins $84.78 ( won +$45.14 )
Ifootball lost -$6
laguite34 lost -$0.50
Hero lost -$39.64always happens from time to time.
I had 2-3 hands like that one today.
I am still up in 971 hands while being 105$ under expectation.
So common.... I have been unlucky today, cards were against me. Lucky rivers for villains. How can I still be winning if its all luck? Don't you think I, and so many other players on this site, do something *cough* skill *cough* to make them win and make those bad beats over a big sample size insignificant to our overall money flow?
Hey Waiboy, you created a monster by teaching him to quote ♦
+1
Originally posted by NightFrostaSS
Originally posted by Termi8r
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by tmannie
Originally posted by TheBrood
Originally posted by Dragar
Originally posted by tmannie
You are obviously a sarcastic little jerk , I however have the hand histories to support what I say. And in fact I do make way more money at black jack
than poker . And besides I have won a few tournies and cashed many times , this however does'nt alter the fact that poker is heavily dependant on luck , keeping in mind tha luck comes in many forms. Skill and study only helps one upto a point.The only reason I play poker is because I enjoy tournies , its as simple as that.Easy solution.
Play BJ.People like you put me on life time tilt.
You are 100% right G1
Nothing against new players and them trying to learn the game.. but ffs.. I hate stuff like what you wrote.
Play me HU right now... I show you luck... grrr...
Aren't you supposed to like... not tilt when you play HU?
I cant imagine why , whether you hate what I wrote or not does'nt alter the facts as evident in my handhistories and like I said I generaly play as close as I can to the book , I dont like those facts either but they exist and I can prove it with my hand histories
You sound to me like you were born on tilt and want blame somebody else for your sad situation
I am on tilt 24/7!!!!!
Everyone knows that.....Now play me sir!! Play me!!!
Nah but seriously...
Dude.. just quit then alrighty?
If ya can't beat the game and don't understand why you don't beat it hence blaming it on luck (this is approximately the same when golfers blame aliens that their shot curved) stop playing it.Poker is a lot of fun... but stuff like this:
$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.comStacks:
UTG laguite34 ($12.49)
CO LepariaONE ($39.64)
BTN Hero ($49.25)
SB Ifootball ($48.75)
BB xmarsholdem ($30.99)Pre-flop: ($0.75, 5 players) Hero is BTN T♣ T♥
laguite34 calls $0.50, LepariaONE raises to $1.75, Hero raises to $6, Ifootball calls $5.75, 1 fold, laguite34 folds, LepariaONE calls $4.25Flop: 4♠ 2♣ T♦ ($19, 3 players)
Ifootball checks, LepariaONE bets $15, Hero calls $15, Ifootball foldsTurn: 9♣ ($49, 2 players)
LepariaONE bets $18.64, Hero calls $18.64River: J♠ ($86.28, 2 players)
Final Pot: $86.28
LepariaONE shows: J♣ J♦
Hero shows: T♣ T♥LepariaONE wins $84.78 ( won +$45.14 )
Ifootball lost -$6
laguite34 lost -$0.50
Hero lost -$39.64always happens from time to time.
I had 2-3 hands like that one today.
I am still up in 971 hands while being 105$ under expectation.
So common.... I have been unlucky today, cards were against me. Lucky rivers for villains. How can I still be winning if its all luck? Don't you think I, and so many other players on this site, do something *cough* skill *cough* to make them win and make those bad beats over a big sample size insignificant to our overall money flow?
Hey Waiboy, you created a monster by teaching him to quote ♦
+1
lol quotaments