Limited Holdem, Unlimited Fun

End of July was same as before - ups and down, downs and ups , resulting in HUGE profit of 0.23bb/100. Though surprise that it's still green
Previous session was something! Starts as usually killing two AA on same table, got some up and then it just started killing me. But there 2 hands were above the usual gloom:

Preflop: Hero is CO with J, J
UTG2 folds, MP1 checks, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, Hero raises, 3 folds, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (6.40 SB) T :heart:, T :diamond:, 7 (3 players)
MP1 checks, MP3 bets, Hero raises, MP1 folds, MP3 calls.

Turn: (5.20 BB) 9 (2 players)
MP3 checks, Hero bets, MP3 raises, Hero calls.

River: (9.20 BB) 8 (2 players)
MP3 bets, Hero raises, MP3 3-bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 15.20 BB

Results follow (highlight to see):
MP3 shows a straight flush, tens high (9h 6h)
Hero shows (Js Jc)

MP3 wins with a straight flush, tens high (9h 6h)

and even better

Preflop: Hero is BU with 7, 7. CO posts a blind of $0.25.
4 folds, CO checks, Hero calls, SB calls, BB checks.

Flop: (4.00 SB) T :spade:, T :diamond:, 7♠ (4 players) (You see - almost same flop )
SB checks, BB bets, CO folds, Hero calls, SB calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 6♠ (3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, SB calls, BB calls.

River: (6.50 BB) 9♠ (3 players) (I expected flush but...)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero raises, SB folds, BB 3-bets, Hero caps, BB calls.

Final Pot: 14.50 BB

Results follow (highlight to see):
Hero shows (7h 7d)
BB shows a straight flush, tens high (8h 8♠)

BB wins with a straight flush, tens high (8h 8s)

Two straight flushes in few hundred hands? Ouch

Originally posted by poger8
>>on the flop you hit trips, why didn't you bet out? why try and slowplay?
Because on unraised boards and such flops when you bet first into 2 opps, in 75% they would fold.

>>slowplaying will only get you into trouble and can be a HUGE leak.
I know, and try not to do it. But when you've flopped few nuts or close, and everybody folds on your first bet, you start challenging this wisdom

that's not the correct mindset to have.

anyway at .25/.50 you will get called, if they fold you've picked up something at least, you hit a hand you bet it pure and simple anything else is a fault.

sounds like you suffer from fps(fancy play syndrome).

Originally posted by poger8
End of July was same as before - ups and down, downs and ups , resulting in HUGE profit of 0.23bb/100. Though surprise that it's still green
Previous session was something! Starts as usually killing two AA on same table, got some up and then it just started killing me. But there 2 hands were above the usual gloom:

Preflop: Hero is CO with J, J
UTG2 folds, MP1 checks, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, Hero raises, 3 folds, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (6.40 SB) T :heart:, T :diamond:, 7 (3 players)
MP1 checks, MP3 bets, Hero raises, MP1 folds, MP3 calls.

Turn: (5.20 BB) 9 (2 players)
MP3 checks, Hero bets, MP3 raises, Hero calls.

River: (9.20 BB) 8 (2 players)
MP3 bets, Hero raises, MP3 3-bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 15.20 BB

Results follow (highlight to see):
MP3 shows a straight flush, tens high (9h 6h)
Hero shows (Js Jc)

MP3 wins with a straight flush, tens high (9h 6h)

and even better

Preflop: Hero is BU with 7, 7. CO posts a blind of $0.25.
4 folds, CO checks, Hero calls, SB calls, BB checks.

Flop: (4.00 SB) T :spade:, T :diamond:, 7♠ (4 players) (You see - almost same flop )
SB checks, BB bets, CO folds, Hero calls, SB calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 6♠ (3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, SB calls, BB calls.

River: (6.50 BB) 9♠ (3 players) (I expected flush but...)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero raises, SB folds, BB 3-bets, Hero caps, BB calls.

Final Pot: 14.50 BB

Results follow (highlight to see):
Hero shows (7h 7d)
BB shows a straight flush, tens high (8h 8♠)

BB wins with a straight flush, tens high (8h 8s)

Two straight flushes in few hundred hands? Ouch

seriously if you thought you were ahead with pkt J's on that board you are badly in need of some help.

second hand why did you just call the flop bet?

by not betting out you are failing to protect your hand in several situations, and are also missing out on value.

from what i can gather from the hands you've posted, you are unable to read the board and also can't assign hand ranges very well.

the bad beats you think are happening are self induced, nothing more nothing less.

try posting some hands without showing the results, cutting off at the point you are having problems with, you'll be amazed at the advice you'll be given.

Thanks for trying to help me. Then allow me to have my opinions too.

>>anyway at .25/.50 you will get called
Yesterday I had flush and straight from flop - guess what - nobody even called my first raises. That's the "help" you got from poker site - you get a bunch of flush/straight draws, rightly call (or even raise) multiple flops/turns and lose a pile of money - and then site "rewards" you this way

>>seriously if you thought you were ahead with pkt J's on that board you are badly in need of some help.
Taking aside your attitude, you might not catch it, but I also got upper straight (not nuts, but still). Yes, I lose to flush or QJ, but may be ahead of many 2 pairs, and 6straight, and slow-playing T trips like KT, and even total bluff. And it only cost me extra 2 BB.
As for full house - yes I wanted to keep more people in pot. Believe me, I have many examples when it really works.

I know my play is not perfect, but have you ever see 2 straight flushes in couple hundred hands?

Yesterday I installed Holdem Manager and spent some time trying to analyze it's options and my play. Some sad results:

3. At some point lost 10 of 16 AA, and each loss was at least 3.5BB. No surprise that AA won less money than few other hands.
2. Currently I'm on streak of losing 12 of 16 JJ (lost 3 last session). Surprise it's still in plus.
1. This is the toughest. I suspect it for long time, just got the proof. In most biggest banks where I played, 12 times I saw the flop and LOSE all 12 with any hands: AA, other big pairs, suited connectors or big A-high cards. In biggest bank I got flush draw + gutshot from flop and called caps on flop and turn in multi-way. Guy won with AA. And only in 13th place pot I won with QJs.

As a "reward" I got following play: Hero with AT, one sad caller, flop 44T, turn T, river T, total profit 3,5BB minus rake. If I could replace this one unneeded out for any of 12 outs in my upper play

Another session adds to my bankroll, and it was also interesting how my stories continue:
3. Aces won 2:1, but only because finally fortune starts returning some debts, in decisive battle got board paired on the river against already flopped 2pair.
2. Jacks won unimpressive 3:2, now stays at 7 wins in last 21. Fortunately with Jacks it's easier to muck them on flop like AK4 after bet and raise
1. Same old. Of 33 biggest pots, I saw flop 13 times, and lost ALL. But playing against one-two timid opponents I get to see my flushes, straights and even quads. Another funny play was when I folded 45o on the blind to see flopped 444

Im sorry but you are playing hideously badly, Im no fixed limit player but even i can see that your bleeding BBs away.
Especially on your example above with the Jacks after he calls that flop you are never ahead especially when there is three to a flush and straight and a possible full house on the table.
Then when you basically have the nuts you dont bet it and complain you get sucked out on......
Quit FL or read up on some strategy otherwise your just gonna keep losing....

You also need to learn to fold, there is no need to go to the river just because you called preflop.

If you can't spot the fish... you are the Fish!

Wacko, if you don't play FL, please don't advise others how to play. I'd basically agree that I might not re-raise river with jacks, and I wouldn't, if not collecting upper straight. Believe me, for some players even simply having top pair is enough to raise, as they may play aggressively even hand like A9, if they think you may raise AK-AJ and miss the board and try to bluff them. BTW Villain re-raised even my turn despite having only 9 and draw, and what if his flush draw was diamonds? Today I got one good pot in situation where with 89s hand I got 898 flop. And check it, and other guy bet and I call, on turn there was Q for a 3flush (not mine of course ) Guy started re-raising me and did it till cap though both turn and river. Yes, the guy might have 99 or Q8, but you need to bet to get some value from hands like mine. I expected him to have at least some flush, how big was my surprise when he showed just 83o
Otherwise session was same dull, small minus, and still 0 of 13 and 3 of 28 biggest pots.
Though today it rewards me in a freeroll. I played like 7-8 MTT in my life (depositor or VIP freerolls) and won only $5 once. I clearly made few bad calls, but today system decides to repay some debts. So I won hands like AQ>KK, A4>KK (4 on flop and 4 on turn), and even 66 > 88. When I finally was in the money, and good prizes become visible, system decides it's enough for me today and I lost all-in 99 < 66
Life is so unfair

Another minus session, almost all big pairs killed and painful set into set. Funniest was the play when I lost 99 on all low board, but another guy lost KK (so I'd lose anyway) to guy who called 3bet with 37s and collected straight. Fortunately for us, Villain just called his lucky river
As for big banks results become more and more intriguing, now my best QJs hand falls to 16th place. How many big pots should I lose before I win one?

Don't care about results. Only and I mean ONLY important is how You played the hand before showdown. If You were 70% favorite on flop, You will win 70% of time in longterm, don't worry.

Even though I realy like the idea of FL player blogging in downswing forum, Your problem seems to be only in Your head. I strongly recomend You to read (and try to understand) psychology articles since complaining will guide You nowhere.

Of course, I'm thinking about my game. It seems pretty reasonable, and trial Leak Buster only finds one small leak for me. Though, no limits for perfection.

You're right, I should probably stop complaining, especially that I'm positive player. Today session was very positive - unexpectedly all my big pairs win - though 2 of them only win SB - yes, everybody folds to AA & QQ, I'm afraid what may follow
Also I finally beat my previous highest win, but new addition only allows me to move - yes again, on 13th spot
BTW, on my tables the biggest pot (33 BB) was won by hand 23o on flop 223. As for real unlimited fun just look at the pic of my Friday the 13th session, isn't it thrilling?

Originally posted by poger8
and trial Leak Buster only finds one small leak for me.

I dont know Leak Buster, but if it's a computer programme, I wouldnt rely too much on it.
If you seriously want to bust your leaks, use this forum .. one it's free, two definitely helpful

btw, after a drop of 70BB I would have stopped playing immediately. Have you ever thought of a stop-loss-limit. I dont know your mindset, only mine, but after a loss of 70BB I certainly cant play my a-game anymore. Maybe it's a leak of mine, but today, when I dropped 20BB .. in 30 Hands btw .. I played on for a while and when I was even I stopped playing. My stop-loss-limit is 50BB

>after a drop of 70BB I would have stopped playing immediately
And then what? Stay with -70BB? Or look at my picture - I got it in plus at the end.
Stop-loss only is good when you fall in tilt. I may be in tilt for a hand or few, so it's not for me. Another time I fell - 100BB in a session, but continue playing and returned more than a half. Is there any warranty I'd get it next day? Absolutely not. Before I tried few times to stop, but there's no warranty too. One time I really decided to test stop-loss. So I stop one session at -40 BB, next day I stopped again at additional -40 (total -80), and in third day it still reached total -100BB, and then only started to grow. Poker is a game of skill and luck. And when you're out of luck, no skill will compensate it, and no stop-loss too. Only continue to play reasonable game and hope that luck will return all losses back in your poker lifetime

Originally posted by poger8
>after a drop of 70BB I would have stopped playing immediately
And then what? Stay with -70BB? Or look at my picture - I got it in plus at the end.
Stop-loss only is good when you fall in tilt. I may be in tilt for a hand or few, so it's not for me. Another time I fell - 100BB in a session, but continue playing and returned more than a half. Is there any warranty I'd get it next day? Absolutely not. Before I tried few times to stop, but there's no warranty too. One time I really decided to test stop-loss. So I stop one session at -40 BB, next day I stopped again at additional -40 (total -80), and in third day it still reached total -100BB, and then only started to grow. Poker is a game of skill and luck. And when you're out of luck, no skill will compensate it, and no stop-loss too. Only continue to play reasonable game and hope that luck will return all losses back in your poker lifetime

true, that scenario could happen .. but just as well it could happen that you have a break even session the next day or a winning session
just as well it could happen that you play on and you cant recover that day. So you might lose 120BB in one day.

It is true that probability doesnt have a memory. it doesnt know how much you've lost recently and it can go upwards again the next hand dealt.

As I said, I dont know you, so no offense

I've been in a down more or less this year. After going up to 2/4 I dropped down to 0.5/1 and 0.25/0.5. Bad luck was then, too, coupled with bad play. I haven't played for the last two months and just wanted to share this without opening an own thread

Going down 2 limits may mean something going really wrong (if don't get cash outs), but also may just mean long downstreak too. I played SSS at the beginning. Starting NL10 SSS with PS free $50, I went up to almost $200, and then deposit some of my money to get a bonus. Playing NL25 for a month I got -$100 playing result compensated by +100 in bonus. Then I realized that I can't clear all bonus and move to NL50, hoping that my downswing on NL25 was enough. That was a DISASTER. I lost EVERY session playing basically same game as before. My stats were "amazing", just remember my TT having winning rate of 10% - and even playing always against AA I should have like 20%. But there was a good time to apply my stop-loss, and when it touched my money, I simply quit for a month and switched to BSS, and now to FL.
Why I remember my SSS time? Yesterday simultaneously on 3 tables, standing after the flop with following: my set against flushdraw, TPTK against gutshot and nuts flushdraw in 3way, in 45 seconds I lost 22BB or 44bb that is basically 2 full SSS stacks. Ouch. In case of flush draw, I also got A on the river, to realize that I was against KK and, yes, AA. And that happened on the same table, where few hands ago with capped AK I got AKx flop and lost also to AA
My advice for you and me? In lower limits FL discipline is a king. Try to play good tight-aggressive, and be always prepared that when you don't have nuts, you may lose your hand. And don't overplay your TPTK when shy guy re-raises you

I've just had a look at TerrorBlade's graph. He lost some 1000BB in about 50,000 hands. Looking at my graph, it doenst seem to be so bad anymore .. thx TerrorBlade

Long time no posts. Still decided to post my probably worst bad beat.
Hero with 99 on BB, UTG raiser, two callers, Hero also calls.
Flop 499 (two clubs). Bingo! 3 players have 2.5BB each in bank.
Turn Q(clubs). Big action, 3 players have 6.5BB in bank.
River Q. Hero bets, UTG calls with remaining 0.6 BB. and other guy calls too.
Showdown, UTG shows QQ and other guy nuts flush. OOps. Fortunately UTG was short of money, and Hero even won 0.4 BB from the flush holder
This is what I call Runner-Runner, not flush, not straight, but exactly 2 cards to beat my quads. Unfortunately there is no Bad beat jackpot there.

wow .. now, that IS a bad beat.

the same happened to a friend of mine .. he held JJ in BB, another player raised preflop, friend called, flop came AJJ, preflop raiser made his cbet, friend check/raised all-in (NL50) .. raiser called and showed AA .. guess what came on the turn

and so the friend lost his free $50

Some sessions are SOMETHING. I taught people to play on schedule, not paying attention to temporary (if so) problems. But my last session was not up to this example, and I finished after only 103 hands. In them:
I got 4 JJ and one QQ and in EVERY flop there was a K or A,
had top pair and 4 card flush to K, of course guy had A,
had trips T, guy collected 4 card flush higher than mine,
and last masterpiece
Hero with 57
Flop 568
Turn 9
River 7, closing also other guy's flush draw.

All this in 103 hands! Hard is life of FL player