Bots on NL50 fr

Hi

I'm from russian community and we also have similar topic about those suspicious nicknames.

We comdined our arguments and stats and wrote petition to 888 support several days ago.

And this is the answer:
Thank you very much for informing us of this matter. Although we have specialized software which monitors all tables and a team of experts who study the games closely, they are not infallible, and some cases may slip though the net. We do our level best to keep our Poker Room safe for our members, and always act on information given.

I understand your concern and would like for you to know that we do not tolerate cheating in any way at our tables from any member and we will continue to ensure that all of our members have a safe and fair gaming environment.

Please be aware that a full investigation is underway, unfortunately I am unable to divulge our findings to you, and this is due to the fact that we have a strict policy of not revealing details of our member's accounts to third parties.

Kind regards,
Sherylee
Operations Department
Cassava (Gibraltar) Ltd

So there are no official results of investigation but I didn't see any of them on the tables today.

Originally posted by AnabolKiev
I didn't see any of them on the tables today.

+1

I've posted this on 2+2:

I'm reviewing my database now and some of those "players" are on NL30SH too.

I don't have many hands on them; actually, only a few. Although they seem to have a very aggressive game, they don't seem however to play all the same.

They do seem to take very bad decisions though, and play even gutshots very aggressively. Needless to say, they've been putting me some bad beats (which is weird). For instance this hand vs. toby_911:

Pacific Poker - $0.30 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players

BTN: $30.00
Hero (SB): $56.38
BB: $63.46
UTG: $92.17
CO: $26.13

Hero posts SB $0.15, BB posts BB $0.30

Pre Flop: ($0.45) Hero has K♦ K♥

fold, fold, BTN raises to $1.05, Hero calls $0.90, BB calls $0.75

Flop: ($3.15, 3 players) 8♣ 6♥ Q♦
Hero checks, BB bets $3.15, BTN calls $3.15, Hero raises to $11.00, fold, BTN raises to $28.95, Hero calls $17.95

Turn: ($64.20, 2 players) 9♣

River: ($64.20, 2 players) 9♦

BTN shows T♦ 9♥ (Three of a Kind, Nines) (Pre 16%, Flop 34%, Turn 30%)
Hero shows K♦ K♥ (Two Pair, Kings and Nines) (Pre 84%, Flop 66%, Turn 70%)
BTN wins $60.99

Would a "computer" really shove a 100BB stack over a check-raise on a multiway pot with nothing but a gutshot? (don't need to say much more about the result on the hand, and these players were "consistent" in such "moves". It might be just variance against me of course ).

and an add up: and the only right thing to do for 888 would be, of course, to give people's money back. Mine is not much indeed, but should be returned nevertheless. But I'm more concerned with people who lost decent amounts.

Originally posted by luizsilveira

Would a "computer" really shove a 100BB stack over a check-raise on a multiway pot with nothing but a gutshot?

what about him being open-ended? w'd that change your suspicion?

Originally posted by 066

Originally posted by luizsilveira

Would a "computer" really shove a 100BB stack over a check-raise on a multiway pot with nothing but a gutshot?

what about him being open-ended? w'd that change your suspicion?

It's not open ended, it's a double gutter.

And no.

To sum up what I posted on 2+2: this is not only a bad play from him, but it's a play that disconsiders table dynamics. The BB is a calling station loose passive. Yes, I am check-raising in a dry board, but precisely this is an awful board to bluff in - especially with two players to act behind, both of whom showed interest for the pot and one that is a calling station.

Now think with me: when villain calls the fish donkbet and shoves over my check-raise after the fish folded, what does he represent? Sets and bollocks. If I have a set myself, $ is going in anyway; if I'm bluffing, he will fold my bluffs by shoving. If he was strong, by just calling he could make me err more without any risk since the board is quite draw-safe.

All in all, it's not about the hand. It's just an example for people to analyze. IMO, it could be a bad regular for all that matters. Fact is, it might be calculating stuff but he/it is def. not thinking about what a regular in that spot should be thinking.

I want to know if Eugene1989 is a bot

His stats look the same but i saw him do couple of things other bots didnt, like 4bet/fold and play hu when table falls apart. Also i think i recall seeing him chat once or twice, but should keep an eye on him

eugene's stats don't look quite like the bots to me, but i only have 800 hands on him.

@ KK vs draw dude: your C/squeeze/call line is just as questionable as his line. it only makes sense with reads, which can be said of his line too.

and your analysis of the hand makes no sense.

and your assumption that an NL30 reg can only be human if he thinks what he SHOULD think is hilarious.

Originally posted by Kruppe
eugene's stats don't look quite like the bots to me, but i only have 800 hands on him.

@ KK vs draw dude: your C/squeeze/call line is just as questionable as his line. it only makes sense with reads, which can be said of his line too.

and your analysis of the hand makes no sense.

and your assumption that an NL30 reg can only be human if he thinks what he SHOULD think is hilarious.

1st: of course my analysis of the hand makes no sense. I suck at poker and never stated the opposite.

2nd: where did I make that assumption? If you had properly read my post, you would see I've written "Would a 'computer' really shove a 100BB stack over a check-raise on a multiway pot with nothing but a gutshot?"

Am I really making the assumption he is a computer? Read again, think again.

Lastly, I only posted the hand for two reaons:

i. because, as I said, that kind of hand, played that way, is somewhat a common place among the nicks cited by OP from whom I have hands on.

ii. to try to help. In other words, I posted it so people who understand more about the game than I do can judge for themselves if this information is of any use.

If it is not, polite people could just say: "thanks for trying, dude, but this hand really tells us nothing".

i'd be thankful for your try if we were talking about something more harmless than botting accusations/suspicions
i play same games and i don't want to be accused of botting.
and i'm not a polite person. and this is a poker forum where we're talking about botting, not a dinner party.

that being said, maybe i misread your post. but fwiw, the best bots have been known to take lines that seem extremely strange to regs.

Originally posted by Kruppe
i'd be thankful for your try if we were talking about something more harmless than botting accusations/suspicions

Interesting. No big deal but we *sharply* disagree on that.

I think the most harmful issues are those in which the community need to gather the most help possible. In the same line, I think we should strive to help as much as possible precisely in those harmful topics, i.e., issues that can harm online poker directly.

If people want to discuss if the avatar of a certain player must be drawn more to the right or to the left of the table, I couldn't care less. But when people are discussing something that can help define and shape the future of online poker, yes I want to help. And I think I have a moral obligation of trying to help. And yes, I think the poker community (i.e., those who "benefit" from online poker whether as a hobby or as income) should be thankful to those who try to help - unless, of course, the people actually harming or threatening to harm online poker. Those shouldn't be thankful.

Unfortunately, I do agree that my help is rather slim. That's due to my very shallow poker skills, for which I do apologize.

Originally posted by Kruppe
i play same games and i don't want to be accused of botting.

Why not?

Interesting, I couldn't care less if I am accused or not. If people did put my screen name here as suspicious I would, well, first laugh, and then be very open to explain my game and/or my database.

And for many reasons. Among them, because if one is not guilty shouldn't be "afraid" of anything. But most of all because it would help to keep a transparent and healthy community, which leads to a more fair online poker gaming (which is the objective of most of us, except, again, of those who do cheat). If people would think I am a bot, revealing my game and replying clearly and straightforwardly to the accusations would help a lot people to actually find out if there are indeed bots and who they are. By comparing that in my game made they think I'm a bot and my human thought behind my actually game, they'd counterfactually learn what a bot indeed is or does.

And then again, having a cheat-free environment is something I'd like to, so why would I mind helping people find if there are cheaters and who they are?

Originally posted by Kruppe
and i'm not a polite person.

That much I could figure our myself.

Originally posted by Kruppe
and this is a poker forum where we're talking about botting, not a dinner party.

Indeed. I don't remind asking you for dinner.

I respect our differences but do not understand why one would be polite in a dinner party but not on a poker forum. I even think the very opposite. I think the less you know people, the more polite you need to be towards them. If a friend of mine calls me an asshole during a dinner party, I will probably laugh and call him a dick; if someone I don't know much calls me an asshole I'd probably not be as happy.

Originally posted by Kruppe
that being said, maybe i misread your post. but fwiw, the best bots have been known to take lines that seem extremely strange to regs.

That much I know. That's exactly why I posted what I thought was a "line that seem extremely strange" and asked what people think. Unfortunately, I don't have sufficient poker knowledge to judge for myself; nevertheless, I am trying to help, within my capabilities, towards a fair and healthy community. Are you?

NL30-50 SH bots, anyone has suspects ?

because i don't want to get banned for being a suspected bot, ldo. there have been plenty of cases of pokersites locking accounts and even confiscating funds wrongly. and before you ask, no, none of the mentioned SNs are mine.

and yes, i want to help too. please don't take my confrontational tone too seriously.

bump!

any news? I've moved up to NL100+ and haven't noticed any obvious bots, which is great.
last thing i heard, the NL50FR bots had been removed. Has NL50 or lower limits been re-populated with bots? are there bots playing higher?