[Closed] 4bet/fold KKxx

I like it. If you had AKK*s then I think you can think more about shoving given your 3bet read (you then have 30% equity v AA**), but without any read that villain is 4betting+ anything other than AA for 100bb I think folding is fine. I think it's AA waay too often.

Plus you don't have any backup at all with your hand, it's pretty much a K or nothing if you're up against AA - you have 22% equity v AA**. With something like KKQJs you have 33% equity v AA**.

Good luck with not losing too much learning!

But why would you 4bet?

I would fold preflop and here is why:

Omaha Hi: 500000 sampled boards
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
Ks 3c Kd 8h 255107 51.02 244893 48.98 0 0.00 0.510
Ts 7s 8c 5c 244893 48.98 255107 51.02 0 0.00 0.490

You have garbage kings. Against any kind of playable hand you really are flipping a coin against them, unless of course you are up against Aces, at which point you're ridiculously crushed.

My point is, if you're up against a fish who is just shoving random hands, you barely have an edge against him, if anything you're just gambling, but if that maniac does show up with the aces, it's big trouble for you.

When you get 4 bet on, it's $18 to win $48 after rake. If we assume he does have aces...

cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
Ks 3c Kd 8h 110227 22.05 389773 77.95 0 0.00 0.220
As 7s Ad Th 389773 77.95 110227 22.05 0 0.00 0.780

Then you're looking at around 22% to win (even worse if he shows up with AKKx !) you need to be 38% to win and you're clearly not getting the odds, so if his 4 betting range is only aces here, then good fold.

To be honest, if you know your opponent is a gambler, then i'd wait for a better hand once you get 3 bet as there are no good flops for you barring hitting on of the 2 kings in the deck (and even then he might have a good draw!)

@ Yoghi: Actually, on reflection, fair point.

Even against a loose 3 betting range you need more co-ordination with your 4 bet hands for the times you are up against AA** eg AKK*s, AQQ*s, AKBBs (all of which play okay v AA** and are only slightly -EV when single suited, and obviously much better v other random rundowns).

If the effective stacks were smaller and you are 4bettting KK** where you can stack off on the flop when called I think the 4 bet makes more sense.

As played, I think you have to fold to the 3bet. You miss most flops, and are pretty much guessing post flop with a bare overpair (unless you have strong reads on villains post flop play ie that they play fit or fold flop). Look for better spots to defend.

Edit: too late, but worth the effort on my part to get the better answer. ♠_cool:

right guys, thanks for the input, they all make sense. i'm still a fish in a PLOOL .