A question about starting hand possibilities

    • slipkn6t
      slipkn6t
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      Joined: 27.06.2011 Posts: 5,581
      As far as I know there are 52x51=2652 starting hands in texas holdem.
      But if we consider the fact that AKs = KAs (let's say both hearts) then we devide 2652 by 2 and get 1326 starting hands (?).
      ok
      But if we count all the cards we get only 832:
      13 pairs from AA to 22 - 13x4=52
      78 suited hands from AKs to 32s - 78x4=312
      78 offsuited hands from AKo to 32o - 78x6=468

      Where is the mistake?
  • 11 replies
    • kunaguero5
      kunaguero5
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      Joined: 09.01.2011 Posts: 1,050
      I think its 12 instead of 6 combination offsuited hands: 78x12=936
    • slipkn6t
      slipkn6t
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      Joined: 27.06.2011 Posts: 5,581
      Originally posted by kunaguero5
      I think its 12 instead of 6 combination offsuited hands: 78x12=936
      ok, so it's 1300 total and not 1326. How come?
      13x4=52
      78x4=312
      78x12=936
      :f_mad:
    • camicio
      camicio
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      Joined: 25.04.2008 Posts: 118
      You have 6 choices for each pair.
    • kunaguero5
      kunaguero5
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      Joined: 09.01.2011 Posts: 1,050
      and its 6 instead of 4 combination of pairs ( :spade: :heart: , :spade: :diamond: , :spade: :club: , :heart: :diamond: , :heart: :club: , :diamond: :club:)
      so:

      13x6=78
      78x4=312
      78x12=936

      =1326 =)


      edit: too last
    • slipkn6t
      slipkn6t
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      Joined: 27.06.2011 Posts: 5,581
      I was going to start a new thread, but I change my mind and post it here:
      In pokerstrategy equilator when I try to compare A6s and A5s vs random hands I get this:
      A6s - 59,906%
      A5s - 59,923%
      A6s < A5s?
    • MJQuads
      MJQuads
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      Joined: 27.01.2008 Posts: 372
      Ofc, 6 kicker insted of 5 kicker makes no difference (basically), whereas A5 can make straights easilly (234).

      To put in practice:

      A6 won't win you pots for it's 6 kicker (or at least it won't win more times than A5 because of higher kicker), whereas A5 will sometimes win you pots with 5 (as I said A2345).
    • slipkn6t
      slipkn6t
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      Joined: 27.06.2011 Posts: 5,581
      Originally posted by Jkob
      Ofc, 6 kicker insted of 5 kicker makes no difference (basically), whereas A5 can make straights easilly (234).

      To put in practice:

      A6 won't win you pots for it's 6 kicker (or at least it won't win more times than A5 because of higher kicker), whereas A5 will sometimes win you pots with 5 (as I said A2345).
      yeah, I understood the idea about straight. A5 just has more chances to complete a straight on river than A6. Thank you :f_biggrin:

      lol I was trying to compare A6s vs random with A5s vs random using the monte-carlo method and waited for like 20 minutes but it seems to be infinite :f_o:
    • slipkn6t
      slipkn6t
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      Joined: 27.06.2011 Posts: 5,581
      Jkob, if I compare these 2 directly I get:
      A6s 56.741%
      A5s 43.259%
      How come A5s is not ahead of A6s anymore?
    • MJQuads
      MJQuads
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      Joined: 27.01.2008 Posts: 372
      Originally posted by slipkn6t
      Jkob, if I compare these 2 directly I get:
      A6s 56.741%
      A5s 43.259%
      How come A5s is not ahead of A6s anymore?
      Because in order to win w A5s vs A6s, you need to hit your 5 (3outs) or make a straight. In all other occurances (which are far more common) you either split or A6s wins due to it's kicker.

      P.S.: Well those situations are not that more common, but are just common enough to give you that 6% edge.
    • purplefizz
      purplefizz
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      Joined: 12.03.2008 Posts: 4,508
      awesome thanks Jkob! :) i loved how you explained things. made absolute perfect sense. :D

      slipkn6t please think of more questions! :f_biggrin: i normally don't ever think about these things.
    • MJQuads
      MJQuads
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      Joined: 27.01.2008 Posts: 372
      Glad I could help. Back in the days the same question bothered me over and over again, since it really is kinda interesting :)