SSS project by a SSS-hater

    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      Hello,

      I am a S&G coach for pokerstrategy.com. I believe my employer offers some real winning strategies on different types of games. I have tried many of these games. I played bss FR, bss SH, and obviously, I played A LOT of S&G's. However, 1 game i never tried is the well known Short Stack Strategy. I notice that there are a lot of threads around here, saying that sss doesn't work, or doesn't work @ certain limit. It would be a losing strategy, and the SHC would be wrong.

      Since the SHC is made for microlimits (NL10-NL25), and I am a total sss-newb, I have started this campaign on the lowest limits. If this thread is popular, I will keep playing sss, and move up in limits. Because I don't think there is any real difference between NL10 and NL25, I will start on the latter limit. Once I made 25 stacks (250 PTBB's) on every limit, I will move up to the next one.

      I started playing 6 tables at a time yesterday (I advice beginners to start with at most 4) and I quickly expanded to 13. I needed to memorize the SHC first, and then I played as many tables as can fit my screens. I played at stars, and here are the stats of my first session:



      Woohoo, major upswing!

      Despite the fact that I play at stars, which is supposed to be one of the toughest platforms out there, the skill level of my opponents is absolutely horrible. I don't think 9PTBB/100 hands is maintainable, but 1PTBB/100 is already enough to make solid profits. Only 15 more stacks to go and I'll move up to NL50.

      My playing style: SHC, postflop strategy as suggested by pokerstrategy.com, except in spots where a different move is obviously better. For example, with jacks, on a QQ4 board, against 2 opponents, I instapush. With 99 from sb first in, and on a reraise from bb, Im not folding it. Etc.

      But, overall, I don't steal at all (i will implement steals when the time is ripe, because that's what beginners are supposed to do too).

      I hope I can show you sss is still profitable, and that I can teach you some.

      Of course, I already posted a couple of hands in the board. I mean, I'm only a newb, remember? So I have plenty to learn about this strategy, and I will do my best to show you what is possible with pokerstrategy.com.
  • 69 replies
    • sw0ldo
      sw0ldo
      Bronze
      Joined: 31.07.2007 Posts: 397
      He owes $5 of those profits to me for calling his push with A4o, he sucked out with AKs obv.
    • armo
      armo
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.03.2008 Posts: 451
      Interesting project, keep us informed!

      And:
      Originally posted by helemaalnicks
      ...
      I'm only a newb, remember?
      ...
      This line would make great signature :D
    • c4ught
      c4ught
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.02.2008 Posts: 58
      I like that your beating NL25 as i cant hehe.

      I got my initial $50 up to 150 which enabled me to play NL25. Im now down to $105 and even though im allowed to go down to $60 ive decided to move back down now so i dont have as much to get back up to $150.

      Will be following this closely good luck. How do you selecr what hands to post in the hands section?
    • Drakhor
      Drakhor
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2008 Posts: 554
      RiverStars one of the toughest platforms? O_o

      Wha...? o_O
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      Your Won $ At SD is very good. I doubt that you can stay that high in long period. Gl with your little project.
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      Originally posted by Kaitz20
      Your Won $ At SD is very good. I doubt that you can stay that high in long period. Gl with your little project.
      it's not THAT weird if you only play ak/aq/aa-tt.

      How do you selecr what hands to post in the hands section?


      I know sometin' about postflop play. Non-standard plays I post.
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      You would old low pp-s in late position first in?
      And the other thing. If you open with AK, JJ, you´re going to call all-in with these hands and they are not favorable against tag re-raise- but since thereś enough money in the pot you have to call.
    • Cardbender
      Cardbender
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.03.2008 Posts: 1,070
      Please keep us updated. I'll be starting over in the next couple of weeks with SSS. It busted me once (unlucky is all) but i did get up to 120$ at one time.

      I prefer Sit n Go's that is where my strength is at the moment. Some day I'll get a coaching session with you.
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      Hello everyone, thanks for the reactions! It inspires me to continue my project.

      Let's start this update with another picture:



      I started playing 18 tables now, because i think i got this strategy in the fingers. As you can see in the graph, my upswing stopped, and my winrate normalized. But, I'm almost halfway there, and that will mean I can move up to nl50 within 1 week.

      I found out I misjudged something in my former post. This winrate is big blinds/100. So not unrealistic at all at the moment.

      Of course I need to learn some extra things about sss, and I will try to join a Xarry coaching as soon as possible. As you can see, I play very tight at the moment, and that's certainly something that I have to be able to change before I reach NL100, because I heard that stealing @ NL100 is compulsory.

      My winrate isn't even that bad. I now play 1000 hands/hour, for a winrate of ~8-9$/hour. Not bad for sss NL25. Let's hope I can move up before reaching the 15K hands mark @ NL25.

      BTW: don't forget I also made ~ 9$ in rakeback already, but I won't count that toward the bankroll, let's say it's an extra I can cash out as a reward for doing well (always good to cash some out after good succes). On NL25, that will be 20$ max, but on higher limits, this will certainly add up.
    • asgeir89
      asgeir89
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.03.2008 Posts: 37
      Are you buying in 20 BB's and cashing out as soon as you get 25 BB's? Thats's SSS right?
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      Originally posted by asgeir89
      Are you buying in 20 BB's and cashing out as soon as you get 25 BB's? Thats's SSS right?
      yes, but only UTG of course. I'm not playing with more then 24.9bb's. I rebuy @ ~3.60 usually.
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      Hello,

      Not many reactions this time, but 522 views, that must mean sometin'. Time for another update. Let's start with another picture:



      Well, that's nice, only 30 bucks to go, and I can move up. Since my winning curve and my learning curve should be approximately the same, I did some studying this week.

      I didn't read any articles yet, because I don't think that's fair towards the bronze members who want to beat NL25, but I did join a beginners' sss coaching by dutch sss coach Sreteb. If you want to get the best out of coachings, you gotta ask questions, and that's what I did (sorry Sreteb). I totally spammed the coaching player, and asked everything that was not 100% clear to me. If I wasn't satisfied about the answer, I just asked again, and again. I picked up some good stuff, and saw him beat NL25 too.

      I also posted more hands, and started to implement a new play, because changing your play gradually is necessary in order to get better. I implemented steals. ATo+, KJs+, 66+ from BU, AJ from MP3, ATs+ from CO. BB into sb who opencomleted, I raise with ATC to 4 bb;s. All went ok, and I still didn't get any extremely tough spots. I ignored stats so far, but I will certainly use stats on NL100+. For now, I'm just happy with my profit and my awesome winrate (2.2ptbb/100 is pretty good, and with 18 tables, that's >10$ an hour). I will keep you updated on the progress in this thread.

      Tx for reading, and good luck on your own ministack-adventures.
    • lordnex
      lordnex
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.04.2008 Posts: 40
      hmm, next time you plan to visit a coaching, how about you announce it here, so we can come and see the questions you are asking? ;)
    • 098799
      098799
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.07.2007 Posts: 1,245
      That's what sss's for: 18 tabling ;)
    • punta
      punta
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.02.2008 Posts: 297
      Nice going - it gives me HOPE

      1. With these steals do you always raise 4 bb's and if re-raised fold?

      2. If your called do you conti bet always and then fold if any one comes back at you?

      Cheers,

      Paul
    • undercover82
      undercover82
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.12.2006 Posts: 813
      I think you are just wasting your time here. You wont learn anything about poker from SSS and you will just annoy the people at the tables who are trying to play actual poker.
      We already know that SSS is a winning strategy , since everything is calculated mathematically. The only reason people whine or doubt it , is because of variance or their own bad plays which they dont understand.
      Personally i think for someone who already knows how to play , there is no use for SSS.
    • TribunCaesar
      TribunCaesar
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.04.2007 Posts: 13,264
      Originally posted by undercover82
      I think you are just wasting your time here. You wont learn anything about poker from SSS and you will just annoy the people at the tables who are trying to play actual poker.
      We already know that SSS is a winning strategy , since everything is calculated mathematically. The only reason people whine or doubt it , is because of variance or their own bad plays which they dont understand.
      Personally i think for someone who already knows how to play , there is no use for SSS.
      I don´t agree. This is no project with the intention of improving skills, even that´s possible because you learn a lot about ranges. But this is a project to show that SSS is working. Because beginners doubt that very often. So i like this project a lot.

      Best regards,
      TribunCaesar
    • undercover82
      undercover82
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.12.2006 Posts: 813
      Well but the player undertaking the project is already a good player , as opposed to beginners. Of course , he will produce better results than the new player if we consider that both have the same luck.
      I would consider bankroll building from a very small amount a much more interesting project :P
    • swissmoumout
      swissmoumout
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.02.2007 Posts: 3,385
      Originally posted by undercover82
      I would consider bankroll building from a very small amount a much more interesting project :P
      like, say, 1$? :D