[NL20-NL50] NL50 FR Riversteal

    • Glazenburg
      Glazenburg
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.01.2008 Posts: 100
      Known players:
      Hero:
      $60,90
      MP1:
      $66,70
      SB:
      $155,80
      MP3:
      $11,55
      BB:
      $47,75
      MP2:
      $71,55
      CO:
      $75,65
      UTG+1:
      $17,80
      UTG+2:
      $20,40

      0,25/0,5 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy Elephant 0.55 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is BU with 9:diamond: , J:diamond:
      UTG+1 calls $0,50, 2 folds, MP2 calls $0,50, MP3 folds, CO calls $0,50, Hero calls $0,50, SB folds, BB checks.

      Flop: ($2,75) 3:diamond: , T:spade: , A:diamond: (5 players)
      BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP2 checks, CO bets $0,50, Hero calls $0,50, 3 folds.

      Turn: ($3,75) Q:club: (2 players)
      CO bets $3,75, Hero calls $3,75.

        Potsize bet to protect or semi-bluff..

      River: ($11,25) T:heart: (2 players)
      CO checks, Hero bets $7,00, CO calls $7,00.

        If i check i lose the hand anyway, CO doesn't seem to be very sure if he's ahead so i try to steal here.

      Final Pot: $25,25
  • 9 replies
    • cindy1985
      cindy1985
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.11.2007 Posts: 358
      I dont think you could get anyone to fold here, the way you played it is so consistent with a draw... and no scare cards are coming on the river.

      Also I would fold the pot size turn bet, since it is actually EV 0$ to call (I don't think you have that many implied odds... except if a 8 shows up). So it seems to me it will only enhance the variance of your bankroll.
    • swissmoumout
      swissmoumout
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.02.2007 Posts: 3,385
      Hi Glazenburg,
      These kinds of bluffs rarely work because:
      1. You've shown no strength throughout the hand (limp, call, call)
      2. No draws completed, so it looks like you're trying to steal the pot. In this particular case, assuming our opponent has Ax, only a Ten beats him, and as this is rather unlikely, any player will call that bet with Ax or better.
      3. Villain's line suggests a medium-strong hand such as top pair weak kicker. On top of what I stated in #2, he now splits with any Ax hand other than AT, AK (supposing he has a low ace), thus is even more likely to call.


      If i check i lose the hand anyway, CO doesn't seem to be very sure if he's ahead so i try to steal here.
      This is true, but betting is still -EV; in 90% of cases these river bluffs will not work, so it's better to just give up the pot when you miss, knowing you'll get paid off whenever you hit your draw.

      The rest of the hand is well played, You have a strong draw (good flush draw + 6 nut straight outs), so it's ok to call a potsize bet on the turn, especially in position.
    • Glazenburg
      Glazenburg
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.01.2008 Posts: 100
      Good and clear arguments Swiss... Thanks a lot. I'm already winning hands or losing a lot less $$$ with the comments i get here...

      Keep it up!
    • tehChipDonk
      tehChipDonk
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.04.2008 Posts: 173
      i think it's okay to raise preflop here since there are so many limpers and you were on the BU, you might even pick up the pot preflop who knows
    • Faye6891
      Faye6891
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.11.2007 Posts: 1,234
      With so many limpers, it's unlikely hero will take the pot down PF, I'd rather see a cheap flop and just limp along like Hero did here.

      But I'd raise the flop, everyone has shown weakness, he got position and J high flush is usually good enough IMO.
    • swissmoumout
      swissmoumout
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.02.2007 Posts: 3,385
      Originally posted by Faye6891
      With so many limpers, it's unlikely hero will take the pot down PF, I'd rather see a cheap flop and just limp along like Hero did here.

      But I'd raise the flop, everyone has shown weakness, he got position and J high flush is usually good enough IMO.
      I agree with the first part, but with 5 players on the flop, you don't have enough fold equity to bet a bare J-high flush draw. Check/calling with odds is better if you ask me

      Regards,
      Craig
    • lilprincess
      lilprincess
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.05.2008 Posts: 2,549
      if you want to rep a T, shove it, but i don't like it
    • Faye6891
      Faye6891
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.11.2007 Posts: 1,234
      Originally posted by swissmoumout
      ...Check/calling with odds is better if you ask me...
      But I didn't ask you, Craig!!
      Sorry, just kidding! :P

      You really think so? I mean, he's got position, if hero doesn't take the pot down on the flop, he can probably check for a free river card if the turn doesn't help, or keep being aggressive... since the turn did help.

      And since everyone checked and CO made a very weak bet, I think there is a good chance hero can take the pot down on that flop. PF a lot of players like to limp and see the flop, but IMO most fold their weak (or missed) hands after a bet and a raise.

      I see your point about check/calling... and maybe I am being too aggressive, but it's been working out for me so far (maybe my tight image on the table's been helping here though). :D
    • swissmoumout
      swissmoumout
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.02.2007 Posts: 3,385
      sure, betting (or raising here) is also an option, and is best if the players are mostly tight, but with 4 unknown players in the pot, there's a good chance at least a few are fish (in this case, you know the minbetter is) who won't lay down ace-rag, maybe not even a T, so you don't have enough fold equity.
      If we had reads on opponents then we could be sure whether a raise is good or not, but here calling is safer.
      imo :P

      Regards,
      Craig