[Closed] NL100 ATo

i would have raised on the flop because you have top pair plus gutshot draw.i think you have the best kicker because i would immagine that if someone had AJ+ they would have raised preflop.they might even put you on a flush draw or a straight,being in bb you could have QT

I would play it the same way as you did. It doesn't make sense to raise on the flop with some many people in the pot. Just call and see what happens...the pot odds are way too good...no way of folding I think. On turn everything is easy...nice c/r to bring more money in the pot. NH

I think a push preflop it's quite marginal, but judging from your opponents stats it looks they play a lot of weaker hands. I for one would have pushed.
Postflop I would c/r the flop. I don't see many hands that have you beat which your opponents wouldn't raise preflop, plus you'll get action from flushdraws, weaker aces, or weaker pairs with gutshot draws.

i think that if i check and then im gonna call a raise from someone i should have raised instead of checking,because on this board you have top pair and the gutshot so if someone raises to try and steal the pot you cant fold.raising on the flop you dont let the opponent get a free card to draw the nuts(a tris or a flush).
what did they say on the dutch forum?

Hi DeKuip,

as you play nl100 I will answer with a little bit advanced sss, you should push preflop so much dead money and against the most pockets you have a flip, better Aces mostly raise so the only thing that worries you is the utg limper.
But you get the Deadmoney very often directly.

On the Flop you must definitely push when you think you are ahead, you have to protect against gut shots and 2 card fdraws. You should get your money in as favourite, so check raise would be really nice. When you are behind you have outs ;-)

Originally posted by xxxdannyxxx
what did they say on the dutch forum?

They've basically mentioned anything here.

Preflop:
- Fold
- Push

Postflop:
- Check/fold
- Check/call
- Check/raise
- Bet/shove

We have 2 judges on the Dutch forum, one of them said Check/Call, other one said Bet/shove.

So opinions were really divided about this hand.

About the preflop push, I also thought it's possible, but I try to get rid of some variance, so I decided to check.
On the flop, I think many lines are possible here. But it's so incredibly hard to determine what range your opponent might have.

In the end I'm really curious what xylere and/or xarry think about this one.
And I still don't know how many outs I should discount here, what kind of hand they can have etc.

And in the end, there must be a line that suits best in this situation. Because I've heard above lines from NL50 SSS-players and higher...

PS: Sorry about the bump, I've been away for 2 weeks and didn't have time to properly respond to this one.

I haven't read other replies, before i posted this one.

against those opponents I would def. consider pushing preflop. And i think i will... With a lower stack decision gets easy

I guess 40 hands (on UTG) is quite enough to figure out his range is pretty wide there...

On the flop I would assume UTG will be betting fairly often
I am too lazy to calculate his "betting" combos, so i will leave this job to anyone who will doubt it But intuitively i would go for c/rai. You will get the most out of the draws and mediocre/good combos.

And imo, betting (first in) here sucks in general, since ranges will be way tighter then in case of you checking.

So you're basically saying that I'm in front and shouldn't try to create FE here?

Now I've read ysessa's reply

and yeah, preflop push is good. you need some experience to play those spots.
but in general you want to pay attention to 2 main points:

1) your stack size
lower stack -> lighter push)

2) Info on the first limper.
the first limper is most important one, because others limp lighter due to the pot odds.

and the flop stays the same)

check/fold is a clear crime))
check/call is also bad, but not as bad as check/fold ♦
bet/shove i mentioned in my previous post

and c/rai is my choice)

Originally posted by DeKuip
So you're basically saying that I'm in front and shouldn't try to create FE here?

FE by betting first in? You will never make a better hand fold here, no matter what you do.
The question is how we extract most value out of worse hands)

So by check/raising you're saying that I'm likely to be in front, or that I just want to make the pot big because I have enough draws here?

Because I'm trying to find the logic in this hand

Originally posted by xylere

Originally posted by DeKuip
So you're basically saying that I'm in front and shouldn't try to create FE here?

FE by betting first in? You will never make a better hand fold here, no matter what you do.
The question is how we extract most value out of worse hands)

Just wanted to edit that post, but I saw your 2nd reply, so was too late. ♦

Of course I assume you are ahead)

The only hands that beat us are KJ&QT = 21 possible combos
while the number of combos that don't will be 100+ at least, i guess

when i say combos here, i don't mean combo draws, but the combination of hands available in the deck

So you don't think that people hold AJ/AQ here (they won't have AK, that's for sure I think) or some other kind of monsterdraw that is ahead?

the other thing

think about their playable ranges
its either pure draws, AX (where x < T)
or ton of possible combo draws, like Kx or Jx + gutshots, backdoors in various combinations

and the best way to play against those ranges is to c/r

Originally posted by DeKuip
So you don't think that people hold AJ/AQ here (they won't have AK, that's for sure I think) or some other kind of monsterdraw that is ahead?

How often they will limp AJ/AQ?

there are only 6 AJ combos and 8 AQ anyway... if it happens one in a while let it be so, you still have some equity...

Originally posted by xylere
the other thing

think about their playable ranges
its either pure draws, AX (where x < T)
or ton of possible combo draws, like Kx or Jx + gutshots, backdoors in various combinations

and the best way to play against those ranges is to c/r

That's a clear explanation
Thanks a lot!

You are welcome)

I will leave it unjudged, in case other judges would like to add something.