preflop: 2 unknown limpers and i raised.
flop: 2,5,8 they c/c me.
turn: J i can represent it by betting but also one of them could have it playing pasive on flop. Smart player would probably donk turn with J in order to protect.
how would you play it if turn was lets say 6 against two opponents?
Originally posted by nemiren
preflop: 2 unknown limpers and i raised.flop: 2,5,8 they c/c me.
turn: J i can represent it by betting but also one of them could have it playing pasive on flop. Smart player would probably donk turn with J in order to protect.
how would you play it if turn was lets say 6 against two opponents?
Pretty much the same I suppose. If unimproved, I wouldn't bet on the river though.
a smart player bet to protect a J on the turn you must be crazy my friend. a smart player would check raise it because he would expect you to bet your range again on the turn.
so donking will actually save you his opponent a bet. and a smart player would he let go of 1 extra big bet. consider this. do you think he would donk because he now got top pair and expect 1 or 2 calls. or if he checks and lets you bet and one call and then he raises. then he would get 2 more bets from you two together , to see a river.
all in all. Check Raise gives you more value than donking does.
a donk bet is exactly what it says FOR DONKS!
in these low stakes a read i come across all the time. the fish and whales i hunt down are pretty much face up. if they donk the turn and lets say its a Q to a 5J2 board. they got the queen .. and i can actually go muck my 77s .
other than 1 or 2 spots , dont get in the habbit of donking.
Id probably bet the turn most of the times. but then again two limpers c/c us on the flop which is decently connected. they limp with anything. wouldn't surprise me if one of them had a 5 and they are never letting them go
as my game is now and looking at these stakes i would just give up against two.. but depends on how much they are folding flop / turn cbets ..
if turn was a 6 i would insta give up no reason in giving them more bets than you need to.
all that to protect ones hand i think you need to take a look at some articles about that because in this case and spot its not to protect a hand. what would he protect it against ? if he has a jack and the other guy a 5 . then happy days for him. At this very moment i can't come up with a spot where to protect. but i think your idea of "protecting your hand" is a tiny bit different than what its meant to be. regarding this hand and spot.
http://i.imgur.com/MvKWM6x.png
ok so we open AKo, two callers. low card flop and we continuation bet... turn's a broadway card. In this spot we can bet or check. Both options are worth thinking about here.
This low card board often gets called so they don't need to have a pair, but when our turn bet is called we usually aren't winning more than our share of the money thats gone in on the turn. In other words, betting the turn is a bet for protection against 6 outers, value against weak draws, and lets us take a showdown if we do not improve.
On a 6 turn I would typically check. It hits a lot of draws and if we get check/raised we're in a tough spot. I'd check back to try and improve and if we don't i'd typically fold the river if someone bet.
I would actually bet in both scenarios. It's right that 6 improves various straight combinations but the only hand that can really raise the Turn is 65 or 97 for the madestraight but a hand like 67 is just going to call and i do consider Jx more as a scarecard than i do with 6x. There are more Jx than 6x combinations possible and each toppair will raise the turn but as i said. Just the madestraights and unlikely 2pairs will raise the Turn when the 6 appears.
A good player would very often checkraise the Turn and not donkbet. Donkbet is not well balanced and people use to bet for free showdown with Ax very often so he does not have to be afraid of seing you checking behind. But there are not many good players on these limit and it always depends on what the guy who now made toppair thinks about your continuationbet-frequency. If you're giving up any2 he should rather donk to get value from the other guy.
Basically with good Ax type of hands you do bet twice on boards like 852J 4296.
Do you agree with the assumption that Jx makes it more likely to getting checkraised and 6 does not or whats your opinion about that?
