€Big10 AKo get c/r on turn

Hey raise2much!

On donkaments like that you can think about making a small 3bet pre -> also to play hu against him! Like 3,2k should be fine!

As played i def. call one raise on the turn... I could have kq, ak, some semibluffs in his range... On the river it depends on his betsizing and on the cards if we want to call (a bet or shove) or fold! But fold turn seems to lose to me! Don't shove the turn yourself... just better hands are calling normally (excpect kq, splits and monsterdraws like 10j :diamond:)

Greets,
Tiltberger

Originally posted by Tiltberger
Hey raise2much!

On donkaments like that you can think about making a small 3bet pre -> also to play hu against him! Like 3,2k should be fine!

As played i def. call one raise on the turn... I could have kq, ak, some semibluffs in his range... On the river it depends on his betsizing and on the cards if we want to call (a bet or shove) or fold! But fold turn seems to lose to me! Don't shove the turn yourself... just better hands are calling normally (excpect kq, splits and monsterdraws like 10j :diamond:)

Greets,
Tiltberger

Hi Tiltberger,
Sorry if I bump in to this thread, but I would like to ask you something..!

First: don't you need to know at what stage is the tournament? This could help you out with the read on the villan. I know being so deep is less important but he's actually putting his stack on risk playing against you.

I agree about the 3bet pre you are advising there, but the problem imo is that if you are in a donkament and the villan is a very loose aggressive, like I think he is bc he has a big stack, he's showing aggression(even if I believe his bet sizes are quite good, but from the pre flop we couldn't know that bc is a pretty standard open). Anyway lets assume that he actually is a donk and if he is how do you react to their typical move(I mean the 4bet shove or even more likely 4bet 26k!)

I mean in a MTT where the opp are mostly decent players you don't worry to much about it bc he did open UTG so if he is opening so deep and then 4betting the table chip leader(depending a bit on the tournament stage), you are likely to be against a very strong hold, so you can decide what to do according to your play style, but anyway you have an information more that helps you to decide, and even more important you prob have better odds to call a 4bet from a decent player then a 4bet from a poor/loose player since the second one is making "wrong"(usually huge) bet sizes!

Then as played I think that Hero bet-on the turn is pretty standard and villan reraise is quite a problem without reads. As I said his bet size on the river is pretty good imo, but on the flop is too small for a donk that has a big hand(if is not a set of 8s 3s or Ks,even if I would exclude Ks as we have a blocker), look much more as a standard half pot c-bet so on the turn I put him much more easily on AKo(We can be sure is not suited!)/KQo/88+(no AA) diamond broadway (even A9s seems matching the followed action), maybe a monsterdraw picked up on the turn(like JdTd as you suggest), on a semi bluff or even a total bluff(maybe with a gutshot like QJo or something like that).

So then I believe as well is a call on the turn, but I don't know then if you call there how could you get away from that on the river, bc the pot now would be around 37.000, having the villan with almost half pot.

If we consider his range tight(so an 6-9% connected to the board like I assumed before) we have an equity of 80% on the turn, and if a diamond(like a 4) hits the river, villan equity is getting around 5% equity.

If we consider him donk/loose(so we put in his range the semi-bluffs and few bluffs too) we have an equity of 85% on the turn, and if a diamond(like a 4) hits the river, villan equity stays pretty much invariable.
So I think considering odds and equity there I really can't think about folding, imo!

Please let me know what you think..

And let me know if you think I should move this to another thread?!

Regards

Marce

Originally posted by marcepoker17

If we consider his range tight(so an 6-9% connected to the board like I assumed before) we have an equity of 80% on the turn, and if a diamond(like a 4) hits the river, villan equity is getting around 5% equity.

If we consider him donk/loose(so we put in his range the semi-bluffs and few bluffs too) we have an equity of 85% on the turn, and if a diamond(like a 4) hits the river, villan equity stays pretty much invariable.
So I think considering odds and equity there I really can't think about folding, imo!

Hey, just making a correction!

I believe I made 2 mistakes! Very sorry about that!!!
When I digit the villan ranges into equilab, I presume I forgot to add in the suited(diamond) Ax! That is changing a lot the equity especially if we assume the villan is a tight player and the diamond hits the river!

Tight: given this range on the turn
KK-88, AhKh, AsKs, AcKc, AdQd, KhQh, KsQs, KcQc, AdJd, QdJd, AdTd, QdTd, JdTd, Ad5d, KJo-KTo, AdKh, AdKs, AdKc, AhKs, AhKc, AsKh, AsKc, AcKh, AcKs, KdQh, KdQs, KdQc, KhQs, KhQc, KsQh, KsQc, KcQh, KcQs- 6,86%hands.
giving him an equity of 24,27%, and getting a 30,36% on a small diamond like a 4/5/6. Of course if he push on the river and we don't put him on a bluff bc we assumed he is to tight and not capable to do that, then his hand is super polarized on the nut flash, even with a Q high flash, if he arrived to the river, he would probably just value bet there imo.

Loose: with a range of
KK-88, AhKh, AsKs, AcKc, AdQd, KhQh, KsQs, KcQc, AdJd, KhJh, KsJs, KcJc, QdJd, AdTd, KhTh, KsTs, KcTc, QdTd, JdTd, Ad9d, Kh9h, Ks9s, Kc9c, Qd9d, Jd9d, Td9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad7d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, QTo+, JTo, AdKh, AdKs, AdKc, AhKs, AhKc, AsKh, AsKc, AcKh, AcKs, KdQh, KdQs, KdQc, KhQs, KhQc, KsQh, KsQc, KcQh, KcQs, KhJd, KhJs, KhJc, KsJd, KsJh, KsJc, KcJd, KcJh, KcJs, KhTd, KhTs, KhTc, KsTd, KsTh, KsTc, KcTd, KcTh, KcTs-10,48%hands.
giving him an equity of 20,02% on the turn, and not changing much if a 4 of diamond comes on the river bringing the equity up to 23,30% , if he is capable of pushing on the river simulating a flush, or having missed the draw, this imo is a very profitable call!

So I actually still think that seen the pot odds I still can't really fold..!

Terribly sorry again for the mistakes, I will read more times the next posts before I submit them!

Regards
Marce

Yeah pretty much agreeing to your 2nd post
for the future pls reopen the thread again (so i can see it)

As you give him the 2nd range -> call is profitable.. and on a blank you can still call if the betsizing is not too ugly

If villain is thinking player and a good regular calling is fine pre... but if hes just agrssive and doesn't get our tight 3betting range here and moves us etc. than 3bet should be very profitable... Also if he doesn't like to fold against 3bets as cl!

Greets,
Tiltberger